https://dialogueireland.wordpress.com/category/christian/magnificat-meal-movement/
Debra since her days under the influence of the Seven Day Adventists has been predicting end time conclusions. This is more of a New Age variant below and suggests rapture rather than apocalyptic conclusions. I am not sure if she thought these events would come her way as nothing like this has happened since 1987 in Vanuatu.
She is likely to be more protected than most as she lives in a typical fortress style bunker with high walls rather than a home.
Like all cult leaders she is afraid as she has a lot of enemies. People who have lost family members or those defrauded of their property. Vanuatu was also the centre of the gold scam administered by Claire Murphy. We will be gathering material to correct the record of her former fanatical supporter Clare Birchley and her friend Claire Murphy who made a financial settlement with Debra in 2012 and as a result basically made it nearly impossible to get to the truth of what really happened. Claire Murphy will have to give evidence about the how documents connected to Mount St Mary’s were signed?
As far as Claire Murphy is concerned we will have to go back to 2003 and a bizarre conference held in Moscow.
Here is material from her web site:
MMM reveals freely the Sabbatical or Shemita Secrets revealed since Sept 1999 incl dates of shemita patterned financial collapses globally which coincide with the Blood REd Moons 2014-2015.
Peace & the IMMANENT “rapture” are a Bible study focus of the end times work of the Magnificat Meal Movement and the founder – to give peace & encouragements especially in 2015 now.
(Last MMM Final Sabbatical or Shemita Secrets Revealed Conference 2014 to be held in Aug, Sept, Oct of 2014 and Feb, March 2015.)
http://www.magnificatmealmovement.com/
Filed under: Magnificat Meal Movement |
Dialogue Ireland 
Which particular bully boy tactics are you referring to voice of the C’s?
Why would Claire’s family support me? I have no role with them since the death of her mother. I supported her mother for nearly 20 years. I have no ongoing need to be involved with them nor they with me. I have seen every move and how she was able to affect the family dynamic culminating in her her return in 2012. All I know is that Claire’s mother was heart broken and fortunately she saw through the joke marriage to John Tonner. I do not comment on the family. They have hopefully made peace with Claire. That is my hope. My job is to make people aware of the truth of what she got up to. The truth will set you free.
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Mike you know very well that C’s family does not support you any more because of your ‘flawed methods and bully boy tactics’.
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I did not say you were, but asked you explain your comments which seemed to be like a spokesperson acting on their behalf. That was a question which you did not answer.
Of course they don’t because to deal with me would burst their bubble and make them have to confront their own involvement. This they are unwilling to do. I have laid out the evidence and you or they have never once replied to it. My impression is that you are under their influence in the way you used to be under Debra’s influence.
In 2003 Clare’s mother made available funds to me to bring me over to Australia and after the silence since 1999 I along with Wal and others were able to bring the MMM to public attention again. Clare amusingly accused me of stalking her at that time. Debra also called the police after I met her in a men’s shop with John Tonner buying men’s underwear and accused me of stalking her. I had two excursions from Helidon in my 11 days in Australia. One was to meet a priest in Twowoomba and by accident after that I had one hour of free time in a shopping centre where I came across Debra. Judy Bloomfield and her former husband Phil also took me to Pilgrim’s Rest. I have the correspondence of that period if you would like to have me publish it. Clare unfortunately, broke her mother’s heart and for the guts of 20 years I would talk to her and try to express the hope that one day she would break with her double life of luxury, an arranged marriage and being an accessory to fraud. When in 2012 through an intermediary we had hoped to meet when she was back in Ireland she shunned the opportunity to do so. By pure coincidence one of my neighbours had their daughters wedding on and the two C’s were invited. She had agreed to meet me but reneged on her agreement through an intermediary. It does not affect me, I was trying to assist her, but as her mother’s champion when Clare was totally under the influence of Debra I hoped against hope this would come to an end before the death of her mother.
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I never suggested you were practicing sockpuppetry where you try to use different IP’s pretending to be the same person. I would ask you to read your comments over the last few days and see if you can see the pattern I noticed. I asked you a clear question? Are the two C’s in Helidon. If they are and unless they are using a proxy there has been no activity from there at all.
Tell us your story and why and how you decided to leave? Very few people have told their stories so Helidon is not understood at all. Fill us in? What was your role and how many of the early members and how many have left?
No I have not suggested nothing is being done, but I am questioning what is being done. Can you describe what is happening and how people are being freed from cultist involvement?
Explain how this happening and what is happening. Also as I asked earlier how can people who settled with Debra be part of the solution until they admit to their involvement in benefiting from the luxury lifestyle. Also they are compromised in that they have not informed the police of their involvement in covering up fraud. Also are any of the people resident in Helidon and surrounds still loyal to Debra?
That person is not MY offsider as you put it, but a person burning with passion after what happened in their case. I must stress they were never part of the cult.
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I know what it is like to be drawn into a cult. I understand how members are unduly influenced and used by the cult leader and core group.
The same problem exists in the Educo cult; members who unduly influenced others in the past, who worked closely with Tony Quinn are very reluctant to come forward with evidence because they were complicit in the web of deceit. When they leave or get thrown out, part of the recovery is coming to terms with this. It is quite shocking for anyone who believed they were doing good to find out they were used and abused purely to accumulate wealth to feather the cult leader’s nest.
I fully understand Anonymous 1’s anger and her desire to want the truth to be known about MMM’s members who participated in growing the cult and who are perceived as complicit because they are selective about the truth of what happened for years. There are a good number of past members of the Educo cult who could put a stop to the abuse today if they only had the courage to explain how they were hypnotically influenced to lure people with emphasis on making money and how a number of them were led to participate in financial fraud.
Anonymous 2, 15 years is a long time to be part of a cult. It can take a good number of years to fully except, understand why you were vulnerable to joining and how certain members may continue to influence you today.
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Dear Mike, I have never acted as the 2 C’s and reject totally that assertion. I am my own person. I’m sorry if you got that impression as it was never my intent. I was in the cult for around 15 years myself, but thankfully am free. I want nothing more than the others to also enjoy this freedom. Do not think that nothing is being done here in Australia. There has been a huge exodus in recent years as you know and we are all doing the best we can to free others from Debra’s control. God Bless you Mike.
P.S I see your offsider has risen to the task! God bless her too.
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It’s very convenient that Anonymous 2 wants to bow out of the commentary when faced with the facts of Clare and Claire’s participation in Debra’s complex web of deceit.
Why defend people that have pulled the wool over your eyes?
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Anonymous 2 You resort to bluster. Answer the question and reread your comments? You act as if you are commenting on the 2 C’s in some of what you write and other times you act as if you are them. As a matter of fact are they still living in Helidon?
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Sorry to disappoint you Mike and just for your records I am not one of the Claires, though I do get some satisfaction out of you referring to me in the plural. And I do not profess to even speak for them. As far as I know they will have nothing to do with you – past, present, future. It’s probably due to your flawed methods and bully boy tactics. I will leave it at that as I see elsewhere you have accused me of being impolite.
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Anonymous 2
Submitted on 2015/03/19 at 9:01 am
Dear Mike
Apologies my comment was incoherent and I have rewritten it here and will reply to the rest below:
First of all I salute him and his wife Beth who were both treated with contempt and even though his health was failing he persisted. Please don’t be too quick to leave the subject of Wal Maggs and leave him out of your narrative. I think from what I am picking up you are suggesting that you have picked up his mantel, but give no evidence as to how you can fulfill that role.
What I am saying when the two of you were up to your eyes in the MMM he was treated with contempt. I would like you to dwell on his contribution and possibly comment on it for those not aware of it. Also can you point me to any statement by you acknowledging your role in the abuse and what steps you have taken to correct your errors? If you were suggesting I was saying that I was the only one who could assist the victims that is just a fantasy. How could I from this distance? What I can do is keep this fraud involving many Irish people in the public domain. For obvious reasons it is a story which has not been told in this country.
I think you are missing my point. You have as yet given no evidence that you are not part of the solution but are still part of the problem.
I could not be clearer:
1. You both have not acknowledged your role in the organisation. Have you made a statement to that effect?
2. Have you told people about your settlement with Debra and as a result you have likely also not told them about your criminal role in forging documents. Note you jump on minor details but ignore these points. I will now having made them about 10 times not reply to you further till you have addressed these points.
3. You have not acknowledged that you both treated Wal in like manner. Also you are only ex in my view in regard to physical facts, not in given any evidence that you mean to make amends or address your own role in this cult.
As I said I have published as many stories that come into the public domain and am in touch with a lot of people privately. However, in what way are you addressing your role?
Anonymous 2. You sometimes talk as if you are the two C’s but at other times as if they are third parties. Could you clarify without breaching your confidentiality what is the case. Also how can Clare Murphy go to the ATO when she was the one who allowed the settlement for Gordon and Michelle occur?
Here is the interview CLAIRE made with Ch 9:
http://aca.ninemsn.com.au/article/8957927/queensland-cult-leader-accused-of-fraud
Note that Claire tells the story start listening at about 8 minutes to get the context.
As you can see from what I wrote earlier this is not the relevant point. What has not been explained is that the two C’s themselves participated in this luxury lifestyle. They give the impression they had nothing to do with it. Luxury from one end of the world to the other. Claire was the one who wrote out to people about the gold sales. Selective in that neither takes responsibility for their actions. That is my point.
AS I have posted for 3 years it is not just going to the police that is needed but actually making a confession about criminal matters. I would first stop off at a Catholic Church. We have published the evidence already. Why are you acting dumb?
Which particular falsehood?
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Dear Mike
“Please don’t to fast and leave him out of your narrative.” I don’t get the first part of what you are saying but the second seems to say you can put him in the narrative but I can’t. How ridiculous!
I, like you, salute him and his wife Beth. Yes they both were treated with contempt by those left inside the cult as we ourselves are treated today by those who still remain. That is always how ex members are treated as you would know being the expert.
“Are their names in the public domain.” Well yes and more and more so. It takes time Mike before ex-members often speak out as you would know being the expert.
“Have they gone to the ATO?” Yes I know a few people who have been in touch with the ATO.
“Is it not (Claire) who stated publically that it was her that arranged for Debra to get a settlement?” No she didn’t arrange for Debra to get a settlement.
“The facts (Claire) has given to Channel 9 are highly selective and do not show that she was up to her eyes in the organisation” Claire sat down with A Current Affair for a couple of hours and talked openly about her experience. It is not her fault what the editor includes or doesn’t. I think you should know this.
“It is not me they need to cooperate with but the police.” And you are right here at last. They don’t need to cooperate with you but they have had a number of meetings with the police.
Mike stop spreading falsehoods.
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ANONYMOUS 1 I do not think they have worked out who you are? They suggested I write to myself. Quite amusing but not to worry. They did not reckon with Aussie rules!
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ANONYMOUS 1 ANONYMOUS 3 is acting as if they were ANONYMOUS 2 by answering your question. We will protect IP’s and I merely state that this time they have not tried sock puppetry
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Anonymous 2 wrote,
By definition I am not attempting to assist people coming out at the moment, in fact I have very little information about the current situation in Australia. I only found out about the death of Wal a few days ago when I phoned one of the first people I got to know in Australia who put me up in 2003. I was very distressed to hear their story. I am really mourning his death and want to give thanks for the principled stance he took. I know you raised similar sentiments about me before but in fact I have kept in touch with a few people since 2003 but never claimed to be the one to assist people. Also as the IP which Anonymous 2 is new but the sentiments are old can see that you are angry as you know you really can’t be part of the solution when you are part of the problem. I assume your gagging agreement is now leaving you open to challenge by Debra? We have shown the documentary evidence of both of your complicity in the MMM fraud. You have nowhere I am aware of come clean in public. You are clear about Debra, but you do not need to be a rocket scientist to come to that conclusion?
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Anonymous 2
“Well all you have to do is write Anonymous 1 in the name section below where you write the comments. Hope this helps you look less silly.”
I have just changed your moniker you had not taken your own advice and changed it. People in glass houses etc…….
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Don’t worry Anonymous 1 I will do it later manually.
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To the anonymous 1 who wrote “The only power I have is to call people out on their bullshit”. Let me do the same… “They are being paid for media appearances” BULL#*+@!. “They do nothing but whine about their own problems” BULL#*+@ (They have) “taken money to stay silent” BULL#*+@! If that’s your only power ‘anonymous’ calling out people “on their bull#*+@ then you are in a very sad state indeed. I urge you to follow some of your own advice and “tell people what the truth is”.
By the way Anonymous 1 thanks for the advice you gave earlier about how to not post twice. It is a shame you had to do it in such a mocking fashion..”: your post will take a few minutes to appear, you don’t need to post another in the meantime, it just makes you look silly and indecisive.” I would like to help you out minus the mocking and respond to a concern you raised earlier when you wrote “I put anonymous 1 before my post Mike, I don’t know how to change my moniker.” Well all you have to do is write Anonymous 1 in the name section below where you write the comments. Hope this helps you look less silly.
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I am not Mike. Interesting question from an anonymous poster……..
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Mike how many different aliases do u write under? Is this normal for someone in ur position?
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Who said we are struggling and bewildered?
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I put anonymous 1 before my post Mike, I don’t know how to change my moniker.
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Again commenters are using Anonymous thereby confusing us all.
I will amend each comment according to IP. Please try to amend your moniker and use number given to you.
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To the above anonymous: who are these “qualified people here in Australia who get it and who are helping?” I don’t think there is anybody more qualified than Mike to understand this situation and help victims. If what you say is true, why are all of the ex members still struggling and bewildered? You obviously have issues and are not very far along in your own recovery. Attacking Mike, who is trying to help, is counterproductive to helping people. Unless you have some real and actual alternative suggestions? Please share if this is the case. Otherwise stop whining like a spoiled child. Sounds like you are one of them and a troll. Offer up something useful perhaps?
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To dear Mike who wrote “They are now victim victimisers” that is exactly why you are right when you say “ No one will replace Wal Maggs in Australia”…because you just don’t get the whole cult thing. I’d be surprised if anyone out of the hundreds who have recently left the Magnificat meal movement reach out to you. They don’t take you seriously as a cult expert. You display traits too similar with the person they are trying to get away from and you just don’t get it. Fortunately there are many qualified people here in Australia who do get it and who are helping.
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Perhaps they could reply to this lady who they were part of scamming?
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Anonymous 2
Yes now that you have no one there to contradict you you thought you could come out and sell your line to the vulnerable who do not know what you have done. I have a feeling that is going to change. I have talked to others who have bought into your line.
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First of all I salute him and his wife Beth who were both treated with contempt and even though his health was failing he persisted. Please don’t be too quick to leave the subject of Wal Maggs and leave him out of your narrative. I think from what I am picking up you are suggesting that you have picked up his mantel, but give no evidence as to how you can fulfill that role.
What I am saying when the two of you were up to your eyes in the MMM he was treated with contempt. I would like you to dwell on his contribution and possibly comment on it for those not aware of it. Also can you point me to any statement by you acknowledging your role in the abuse and what steps you have taken to correct your errors? If you were suggesting I was saying that I was the only one who could assist the victims that is just a fantasy. How could I from this distance? What I can do is keep this fraud involving many Irish people in the public domain. For obvious reasons it is a story which has not been told in this country.
Are their names in the public domain. 1. Have they gone to the ATO? Have they acknowledged that made a settlement with Debra which involved the evidence of criminal activity has been lost to the police?
If it is Clare Birchley is it not she who stated publically that it was her that arranged for Debra to get a settlement?
I have just reviewed that documentary that Clare appeared on. The facts she has given to Channel 9 are highly selective and do not show that she was up to her eyes in the organisation, the marriages and the fraud with gold. I actually have had correspondence from California from a mother who dealt with Clare Murphy. No you can’t actually tell the story as you are part of the problem not the solution. Clare Murphy herself was part of the arranged marriage system with John Tonner. So it is not me they need to cooperate with but the police.
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What I mean is that Debra treated the Gaffney family abominably and as I wrote I intend to publish about it. That in no way questions the the excellent interview provided by Eilish.
Yes indeed and I remember when they left Ireland the consequences that had for people in Longford. She did an excellent piece.
Which particular lie are you referring to?
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In order to avoid confusion we will have ro change the name anonymous to avoid confusion.
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Well this is escalating quickly! Interesting reading, I have personally just popped into this thread out of interest. How quickly people turn on each other. One of these anonymous people can’t seem to decide how to express themselves and has to post two versions of every sentiment that are slightly different (hint: your post will take a few minutes to appear, you don’t need to post another in the meantime, it just makes you look silly and indecisive.) Another anonymous seems very angry and clearly has an emotional investment. I think one of these anonymous people might be one of the Clare’s, how else to explain the offence taken. Hey Clare/Claire, grow a set and speak as yourself. And, if you want to comment, look at the ENTIRE post in context, and address it. Not just one small part. The angry anonymous raised some points that the indecisive and silly anonymous ones did not address at all. Because they can’t or won’t? Maybe all of these anonymous people should put a name to their comments, and be brave enough to say who they are, all of you above. I don’t really care either way, as I said I have just popped by. I think you are all a bit ridiculous.
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To anonymous above who says “Who the hell are you … and what is your interest?” I anonymous say the same “”Who the hell are you … and what is your interest?”
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What a liar you are! They were not paid a cent! God forgive you. Unbelievable that you would write something so horribly wrong. Shame on you…but do sleep well at night I least wouldn’t wish that upon you.
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Wrong again…they were not paid. What a lier you are!
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To dear old Mike who said “Wal Maggs the first courageous person to stand up and be counted has died, but we have had no one to replace him in Australia.” There are lots of courageous people following in Wal’s footsteps and standing up to Debra… Is it because they are not cooperating with you that they don’t count? Even Beth Maggs, Wal’s wife, supports the Claires in their exit and efforts.
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I am using a number next to your name for clarity. Could you use it as I had to check IP’s before designating it.
They are being paid for media appearances in which they do nothing but whine about their own problems. They have the actual evidence with which to bring Debra to justice but they dont. Because they have signed a confidentiality agreement and taken money to stay silent. I have done everything in my power. Unfortunately I don’t have the evidence required, only my personal experiences. I would do ANYTHING in my power to bring about justice. If I could. Unfortunately the only power I have is to call people out on their bullshit. Who the hell are you, above anonymous, and what is your interest? What have YOU done, or are you one of them? Sounds like you might be.
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To dear old Mike who said “Wal Maggs the first courageous person to stand up and be counted has died, but we have had no one to replace him in Australia.” There are lots of people standing up to Debra following in Wal Maggs’s footsteps…don’t they count Mike because they are not cooperating with you?
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To the anonymous 1 who posted “If they had a shred of integrity between them they would expose Debra”…they have done 4 newspaper articles and a television interview over the last few months to expose Debra; what have you done? As Elaine wisely said “Bitterness is a fright!”
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To anonymous 1 who posted “If they had a shred of integrity between them they would expose Debra”,,, they have done 4 newspaper articles and a television interview since they left; I think think they are doing their part in exposing Debra. What have you done?
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I am using a number next to your name for clarity. Could you use it as I had to check IP’s before designating it.
What do you mean Mike “The scandal of the Gaffneys and no one yet ready to stand up to Debra.” That was Eilish Gaffney on A Current Affair standing up to Debra. Why the lie?
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Those two “ladies” are just as guilty as Debra. To pretend they are victims is disgusting behaviour. If they had a shred of integrity between them they would expose Debra. But no, they prefer to pretend none of it was their fault, and if they received a financial settlement from Debra then they are still living of the proceeds of her crimes against innocent but gullible people. I hope they can’t sleep at night. I remember being bailed up by Clare Birchley and abused because I questioned Debra. They were both complicit in a specific incident involving my family which was devastating. I am here in Australia, and I haven’t forgotten.
I echo Mike’s sentiments above to Elaine. If you know the truth then grow a spine and tell people what the truth is.
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Elaine we understand you would like the history of the MMM to go away. However, there are so many car crashes and families who are are still mourning. Where is Dermot Forkin a very open and loving priest? A whole family have been painted into a Queensland backwater. The scandal of the Gaffneys and no one yet ready to stand up to Debra. Do feel free to move from fiction to fact? We would be delighted to publish it. We think of the people of Vanuatu at this time. Don’t generalise and give the impression you are really worried we are about getting revenge. I will not tell you what some people have said about Debra. I hope she survived as I for one want meet her in court.
Let us have your mature reflection on what is fiction and what is fact?
So you are the ones with the real story, we are waiting to publish it.
Are you referring to to your role as a supporter in this country of Ireland? What do you mean you are a personal contact? Normally the purpose of comments is to respond and give evidence for an argument, not cloud the issue further. Give us your facts? We are waiting for your corrections.
I am sure you do. You would like the facts about this go away. Well it will not. People involved in destroying marriages, stealing money from many people and abusive use of power are not victims. They are now victim victimisers. If they had taken a stand against Debra and used the evidence they had they could have brought Debra to justice. One claimed to be the one who helped get a settlement for Debra. I rest my case.
Here we are distant from the scene of the crime, but we are not distant from the issues. We have had in the past month calls from people affected for years. Wal Maggs the first courageous person to stand up and be counted has died, but we have had no one to replace him in Australia. No we are not distant but waiting for the time we can bring this terrible scam to an end.
Generally facts emerge over time, but what about the facts that have already turned up and have not been addressed. They should leave your friends with red faces. If on the other hand they had evidence which was genuine they could have made it available on their visit to Ireland in 2012. We have offered anyone the right to post information on this site once it is grounded in fact.
Let us know who profited from this other than Debra, and her cohort of supporters? Many of her own members and supporters have also been fleeced.
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Bitterness is a fright! Like a child throwing it’s dummy from the cot when it does not get it’s own way, ‘people’ go to entertaining lengths to fictionalise what they think is fact!! Quite entertaining to those involved!!
As a personal contact for the people involved in this, I can confirm that some of the information on this ‘piece’ is untrue and stands to be corrected . The people involved , and I speak of myself also, EVERYBODY wishes to move on. It’s a shame those looking in from the outside are unable to do the same.
The facts will emerge in time, and when this happens there will be a lot of people left red faced.
Money is the root of all evil, not just by Debra’s standards but also to those who profited well in the throws of all this.
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