Can An Educo Follower Still Trust Tony Quinn? By an Educo Fan

“The important thing is not to stop questioning. Curiosity has its own reason for existing.”
– Albert Einstein

I’d ask any existing Tony Quinn follower or supporter to read this carefully and ask themselves honestly if they can agree with even a small part of it. As a follower of Tony Quinn, many of the newspaper or other articles I’ve read in the Sunday papers or on Dialogue Ireland appear to be too angry or one sided and instantly put me into defence mode. This article began as me privately putting my thoughts on paper to try and clarify them with regard to what me opinion on Tony Quinn was. I’ve always been one to jump to his defence, and I wanted to make sure I was doing the right thing.

Although there are many people with grievances about him, there’s no question to me that Mr. Quinn has benefited many people. I would say that for me personally, my life is better because I’ve done a seminar. I have a respect for people who have gone and done a seminar. They’re they type of people who raised their hand and said to themselves I want more from life and I want to live my best. I admire that in people.

I’ve read articles that dismiss his teachings as something you could pick up for €0.50 in a 2nd hand book. I think this type of attitude belittles what he does. He is a highly skilled teacher who can take basic teachings (borrowed from Zen Buddhism and Christianity, New Age, NLP, Pop Psychology) and put them across in a very simple way that will help anybody in the room understand these things in a new way. I’ve seen several people who were very sceptical going on seminars and coming away very impressed by him afterwards. There’s a reason for this; he has a talent in convincing and persuading (some might say hypnotising) his audience of what he wants them to believe. He is fantastic at simplifying things and putting them across in a way that seems new and interesting, even to people not particularly interested in personal growth.

However, it’s important to separate it out and see that this is not a defence against other misbehaviour. I think that’s why many people don’t question it too much when they see things about Mr. Quinn they are uncomfortable with. We associate Quinn with a high point in our lives and this association may cause us to not see his faults and defend him against attack (I’ve felt that to be the case with me anyway). When defending him you almost feel like you’re defending your own way of life.

I remember two years ago meeting one of the biggest American millionaire yoga gurus, John Friend, over dinner at my wife’s friends house. I sat beside him at dinner, shared some wine, and thought he came across as a decent and genuine guy. About 8 months later a big story broke in the U.S. after it emerged he had been cheating on his
cheating on his partner with lots of other girls and had misappropriated pension funds of his staff.
http://jezebel.com/5886795/yoga-mogul-turns-out-to-be-a-total-scumbag
I then read an article by one of his followers where she was disassociating herself from him.
http://bernadettebirney.com/2012/03/moments-i-might-have-spoken-up-but-didnt.html

She pointed out that she had noticed things over several years that she had become uncomfortable with but as she saw him being part of a greater good, she turned a blind eye to them. She later realised that by continuing to endorse and support a person that was causing harm, that she and her silence and complicity were also part of the problem. John Friend has helped transform a lot of people and was facilitated thousands of people in huge personal growth. It doesn’t mean that it’s ok for him to be dishonest and misappropriate their money. “Spiritual” or Seminar leaders getting too powerful and abusing their position it turns out is a very common thing.

It reminded me about all many things I’m uncomfortable with about Tony Quinn that I hadn’t really given too much attention to, or had just passed off or ignored, denied or didn’t want to believe or connect the dots. I’ve found it all to be a some what confusing experience. On one hand I did what I believed at the time was a fantastic seminar from what appeared to be an all round fantastic guy. On the other hand I began seeing too much incongruence between what he said and what he did. There are too many things I noticed about him and his organisation that caused me to have question marks about both him and the success level he claims. It was even hard to start writing this down as I noticed my mind spontaneously jumping to his defence all the time until I had to keep mentally taking a step back and imagining that the person I’m discussing is not Tony Quinn, but someone else, and asking myself how would I view it then? Here are the things that caused me to start having questions about him:

Role Model Guy
For years at Sunday seminars Quinn put a certain guy on a pedestal and continually talked about how great he was and implied we could be more like him. The reason he was allegedly so great is because he was so good at selling seminars. I’d be listening to this almost feeling inferior for not being a great guy like this role model. However, my own direct experience of this role model is that he was not a genuine, honest or decent person. I felt serious incongruence between my own direct experience and Tony’s proclaiming from the pulpit about how great he was. I always thought it was wrong of Tony to put him on this pedestal. It’s pretty apparent that Tony put him on this pedestal as he was so good at selling seminars and he wanted to get everyone else focused on this goal even if it meant holding someone dishonest like this up as a role model. This was one of the first eye openers to me about how Quinn may not be as genuine as I hoped he would be. I wasn’t in any way surprised when a few years later it emerged that this great role model had been secretly stealing money from his business and was fired by Quinn (before reappearing later in the UK and getting a lot of UK people on seminars.) To take the example away from Tony Quinn, imagine you go to a church every Sunday where the preacher praises a certain member of the group every week with comments like “maybe you can be more like a Peter”. However, if you really didn’t trust this guy “Peter” (not HIS real name), then you’d be wondering why the preacher praised him so much. When you realised that “Peter” was one of the preachers top sources of income, they you might start to understand why the preacher wanted everyone to be like him, and you might start to distrust the integrity of the preacher. With hindsight, I should have paid more attention to this red flag when I noticed it. However, I wasn’t in a place where I would even consider questioning Tony.

Exclusiveness of His Teachings.

With the way he talks, you’re made to feel like nobody else has the answer only him. You’re practically discouraged from reading other books or attending other seminars. Dali Lama etc just don’t know what they’re doing, but he does. I remember a guy from my 1st seminar told me quietly a year later he did a retreat with Eckhart Tolle and not to tell anybody. He was nervous other Educoists would be disapproving of him for doing another course. I remember a friend of mine was really put off the seminar when she picked up on the language of one of the people telling her about it and saw the exclusive nature of it. She told me it bothered her and now that I think about it, I agree with her.

This is a biggie for me when it comes to Quinn.

In one breath he’s telling you you’re “life”(God) and you have the answer but in the next breath he criticises almost every spiritual teacher on the planet except Buddha & Jesus. Once I remember him saying [paraphrase]: “I don’t think Buddha would have put this across as well as I did there”

He’s subtlety trying to get the group to mentally put him on the same page as Buddha.

Hypnotising People to sell seminars
On my seminar, we were effectively hypnotised to sell seminars. i.e. we were put into a state of deep relaxation and given an NLP program which included that we get excited about getting more people on seminars. Yes, it was presented in a way that made it seem like it was our goal and we were helping people, but we may as well call it what it was: hypnotising us to get more people to spend €19,000 on one of his seminars. Along with my love of this type of material (from Quinn and others) this would have contributed to me pressuring others into getting them on a seminar. I now regret the way I pushed Tony Quinn seminars on so e friends and family and perhaps I need to apologise to one or two people for being too pushy about it. I don’t foresee Quinn apologising to me for unwittingly hypnotising me to become his salesperson.

Multiple Seminars
I know lots of people who have done lots of seminars and have repeated several times. Did all those additional seminars really make a lasting and significant positive difference? In my opinion, the main net effect of many of the repeat seminars is that the attendees are poorer (possibly burdened with years of paying the money back) and Quinn is richer. Given that these people have probably been hypnotised to get more people on seminars and several may be financially burdened for years afterwards I don’t think it’s fair orresponsible of Quinn. It almost reminds me a little of one of those Indian spiritual gurus who’s very rich and has a lavish lifestyle supported by a groupof poor devout followers. Somebody else said to me that Quinn is like an irresponsible bar man continuing to serve a drunk who isn’t aware that they’ve already had too much. Considering the hypnosis we’ve been through, I don’t think it’s a million miles from the truth. People have pointed out to me that the organisation doesn’t aggressively pursue seminar attendees who haven’t paid. It certainly wouldn’t be good PR.

“Mind Masters”Attendees:
This doesn’t apply to everyone as I know several people who have actually found benefit from this €50,000 seminar. I’ve noticed too many people on very low incomes attending these seminars. Fair enough, people have freewill and are entitled to make their own mistakes, but with the nature of what he claims he is doing in terms of helping people, Quinn should have some sort of responsibility to make sure that by and large, people are benefiting. What concerned me was seeing two people on really low incomes (out of work teacher and gym instructor) who were already on a regular beginners seminar (both multiple repeat attendees by the way). The numbers for the next mind masters were very low and these two were convinced to stay on for the “mind masters”. I was annoyed when I become aware of this as the two people had already been on several seminars and barely had two red cents to rub together. I know that doing another seminar wasn’t going to do them any good. Tony had another 100kor so credit and they’ve got about a 100k burden between them holding them back. This bothered me. There are lots of others who work for low incomes in the shops and seem to have gone on these 50k seminars and don’t seem to be financially better off but are likely worse off because of it. How many of the people now working in the shops who have done mind masters seminars have genuinely made an additional 50k in after tax profit because of what they learned on this seminar? Seriously? I’d think next to none. However, I’m guessing they felt a huge amount of peer pressure to do it and were made to feel like it’s something that was going to be very important to advance their lives.

Other Attendees
Although the seminar has some useful information and I admire people who are not afraid to take two weeks out to do it, some of the people who have done the course don’t come across very well when you meet them later. They could scare you with their over enthusiasm for the material. (I myself was guilty of this when I returned from my seminar and I regret the way I behaved with some people I know.) Have they achieved as much success as they like to talk about or that Quinn would like to make out? Although I still think much of the material has genuine value, I think only a tiny percentage has achieved the success Quinn would like to make you believe.

His Right Hand Man /Cameraman
He “closely befriended” certain women during the seminars, one of which I know was married at the time. I’ve seen a case where 3 women appeared to be in love with him around the same time and this must have been very distracting from the seminar. Quinn must/should have been aware of this behaviour but it appeared to continue. Not exactly an inspirational guy is his cameraman, who has worked for him for decades and doesn’t appear to have much to his name. I know people who think he is very rude and is a very poor ambassador for Educo. It leaves people wondering if Quinn is allegedly so great, why he has such a rude person as his right hand man.

Hard Sell
Several people got other on seminars via a very hard sell with a lot of pressure being applied to go out on a seminar. It shouldn’t have to be such a hard sell if the positive results from the course are so apparent. A softer hard sell I got one day was from a nice lady (who I like, and who genuinely believed what she was saying), was trying to get me to go for the sake of helping out Quinn and she felt pity for him trying to continue his important work and only having a few people in front of him to hear his message.

Qualifications:

Do you really believe“Dr. Quinn” has a real genuine Ph.D, and not an order off the Internet version?Look at the Wikipedia article specifically on “Dr. of Clinincal Hypnotherapy” According to this piece;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_of_Clinical_Hypnotherapy

“In most USA states, itis a criminal offence to use the title “Doctor” if the doctorate is received from an unaccredited institution” There is even a reference to the psychologist Dr. Steve Eichel, who managed to obtain a hypnotherapy degree for his cat, “Zoe.”

I think it’s disingenuous to misrepresent yourself as a “Dr.”, especially if you’re promoting yourself as a spiritual teacher while trying to put yourself on the same level as Buddha and put down the Dali Lama. He’s clever enough to mostly avoid outright lies but I’m seeing a consistent trend of serious exaggeration and misrepresentation, bordering on lies.

Supplement Business
I was at the Sunday meeting maybe around 2002 or so where he was introducing the new supplement business for people to get involved in a monthly payment (or something along those lines). He presented it as a no brainer for making money and was inferring we’d be stupid for not taking it up. I thought his approach and attitude was demeaning to his followers. It later turned out people weren’t making money from this and it didn’t take too long for this apparent money maker to fizzle out. Why did he pressure his loyal followers into a scheme that wasn’t worthwhile and almost make them feel stupid if they didn’t think it was great idea? I lost a lot of respect for him that day.

Results from those close to him
It’s disheartening to see so many people in his inner circle who have devoted their lives to him and his Educo message of wealth and abundance but they’re still practically broke or any money they’ve earned has gone straight back to him on seminars. The Educo message clearly isn’t working for them but their adoration of him is possibly ensuring they stay out of pocket. If you look at the majority of people very close to him you’ll notice the one thing most of them have in common is, no money. Look at the situation honestly and this is clear as night and day.

Educo Gym:
I think the training system itself is great and I think this has benefited people. What I don’t like is the business model. Yes, some of them are probably successful (perhaps run by already successful people) but I don’t know if the success rate of them is even 60%, which would be a very low success rate for a franchise. I don’t know all the facts, so this part of my article is speculation rather than direct observation. I’ve noticed many of them going out of business. Who lost money and who made money? With the way it was set up at the beginning,someone who had a friend involved later on said to me “it was never going to work financially”. My response was; “for whom?” Although some investors have lost a lot of money, Quinn would have made a lot of money from them. It also served to send a lot more people on seminars and keep his business model of seminars going. Again, the training itself is great,but Quinn knew he’d be able to convince a group of his most devout followers to sign up for a scheme in which many of them lost money, but he got a big payout and a lot more seminar attendees.

His Business Success (or lack thereof):
We were led to believe that several business have been highly successful because they are using the Educo business system. Quinn has brought people up on stage showcasing their business as an example of his/Educo success. If that’s all the information I went on,I’d be going away thinking that these businesses were highly successful largely due to Quinn’s system. However I found months later that some of these businesses had later gone bust. I didn’t hear Quinn update us at the next Sunday meeting that these highly “successful” business had gone bust,along with teaching us what part of his system needs to be adjusted to help ensure other businesses following his success system didn’t fail. It also brings up the question of why businesses he a significant shareholder in, and apparently should be highly successful, would fail at all. In the recent court case involving the oil company, Judge Bannister who was not under any hypnosis to Quinn, could only summarise the amazing business system as “no more than advice to promote better employees in preference to inferior ones.”

Scientifically proven business success

The results of this Scientifically Proven Business Success came from questionnaires we were asked to fill out on one of the Sunday seminars in the early 2000’s when the country was in an extended boom. We would have been listening to him talk for hoursabout being successful etc and then with everybody in a high and hyped mood we filled these out. I forget the figures I used but I remember in the moment I filled out the results in the most positive, possible terms, using gains I hadn’t yet realised. I’ve spoken to other people who admitted to me that they exaggerated the results they put down. It’s an understandable thing to do in this hyped environment where you’ll feel like a loser if you’re not oozing success. If accountants and auditors evaluated the bank accounts and investment returns of each person who filled out these questionnaires, I’d be surprised if they differed much from the national average. From my own observations of the people involved and the circumstances in which the results were written down, I don’t in any way believe this business success is “scientifically proven”,although I don’t see Tony looking for any scientific independent testing to revalidate the results people wrote down that day (or the results Quinn claimed they wrote down).

Scientific Gym Training results.

I don’t think they stand up to scientific scrutiny. If you take a bunch of people training in the basement gym of Eccles St. Dublin, do you think they are going to push as hard in the gym (or be as diligent with their diet) as a group of people who have just invested €19,000 on a seminar? In my mind this was a clearly flawed study due to the control group having such a significant difference from those on an intense seminar in the sun. I’m surprised he got this approved by the university but they would have never thought of the valid point above. When I was in university I remember lots of people “creating” the results of their studies and getting honours degrees.

Distancing himself from failure and letting others take the fall.

I’m not privy to all the facts so I’m not sure how much truth is in this, but my understanding is that when a business he’s involved in goes under, he distances himself from the failure and allows the blame to rest solely with his business partner. Ensuring Tony is not tarnished and can continue his work without negativity attached is of upmost importance. (His barrister seemed to be taking a hit for him in court by embarrassing herself by saying she made a mistake on a key point.)

Making Money Outside of Seminars.
He remarked on a 2009Bahamas seminar that he wouldn’t attend the seminar of someone who only made their money from selling/giving seminars. He’d only be interested in learning from someone that that also made a lot of money in business. I’ve got big question marks over how much money he can make in business and not due to seminars or people he’s got huge influence practically giving it to him.

THE Answer

Every 6 months or so there seems to be a super-fantastic new scheme that is THE answer with a groundbreaking must-attend seminar and reason to attend the Sunday meeting.You’re left thinking…“hold on, I thought we got THE answer loads of times already?!” If you’re putting yourself across as a spiritual teacher I think it highlights that your promise of a previous answer actually being the answer was false, because if it worked, you wouldn’t have to keep repackaging it as something new. It’s just a bit sensationalist for something that also alludes to be so spiritual.

Cash for prayers / postal requests.

If I saw this payment for requests/prayers scheme with a Californian Evangelical preacher I wouldn’t be too surprised

Egomaniac.
I’ve come across lots of critics refer to him as an egomaniac. I’ve always brushed this off as just critics trying to tarnish him and make baseless allegations. Given all the things I’m uncomfortable with I can start to see why people describe him in this way.

According to theWikipedia article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder

Symptoms of this disorder include:
Exaggerating their own importance, achievements, and talents
Taking advantage of others to reach their own goals
Imagining unrealistic fantasies of success, beauty, power, intelligence, or romance
Requiring constant attention and positive reinforcement from others
Lacking empathy and disregarding the feelings of others
Being obsessed with oneself
Pursuing mainly selfish goals
Trouble keeping healthy relationships
Setting goals that are unrealistic
Appearing unemotional

Possible causes of Narcissistic Personality Disorder include:
An oversensitive temperament at birth
Excessive admiration that is never balanced with realistic feedback
Excessive praise for good behaviors or excessive criticism for bad behaviors in childhood
Overindulgence and over valuation by parents, other family members, or peers
Valued by parents as a means to regulate their own self-esteem

I do think he has excessive admiration from his followers with a lack of honest feedback fromthem. From the way he talks about his parents, it appears they doted on their only child excessively.

Critics.

Just because certain critics in the media are out to get him (which they are) and they distort the picture (which some do) isn’t a defence for him and doesn’t mean he’s immediately innocent of what they might be accusing him of.

Keeping The Numbers Up
I know someone who was on a seminar around 2008-9 that was about to have a very low number of attendees. However the night before the seminar started, a group of people was flown in from the oil company in Belize. These people sat at the back of the class and didn’t appear particularly interested in the seminar. Along with the Belize group there were some other repeat attendees, with only a tiny handful of new attendees. It appeared to me that the Belize group had been flown in to keep the numbers up and help show that the seminars were still getting enough attendees to look successful, along with lining Quinn’s pocket, at the shareholders expense. The recent court case shows that BNE spent USD $718,000on Tony Quinn seminars in just 3 years. I thought this wrong on several counts:

1. If I was a shareholder of the oil company I’d be very annoyed that a lot of money was being squandered sendingdisinterested people on an expensive course they appeared to have littleinterest in. I’d be annoyed if I heard they were wasting money on excessive photocopy paper, let alone wasting hundreds ofthousands of dollars on a seminar they didn’t seem to care about.I’ve since learned that some of the people from the oil company have been senton the seminar several times. In court, the company defended this by sayingthat the employees were sent on seminars to increase productivity. A friend ofmine on one of the seminars with the Belize employees commented that the peopleon the seminar were low threshold employees who didn’t appear to be in highlevel positions. I speculate that low level employees in Belize would earnsimilar or less to the GDP per capita $8,500 (vs $40,000 for Ireland). Let saysthey paid full price for the seminar (as there were huge figures paid toQuinn): €19,000($23,400) + air fare to Europe $1,000 + expensive hotel @$190per day $2,470 = $26,870 per low level employee that went to Europe and sat atthe back of the class, taking away from the seminar of those who paid thousandsthemselves.

Even if they doubled their productivity, (extremely unlikely), or even increased it by 1/3, it would take years for this investment to pay off, even in a best case scenario. I’d say for most employees who attended and learned his “business system” there was little or increase in productivity. Be honest, if it was your company, would you spend $718,000 of your own money to send employees on Tony Quinn seminars?

2. By flying in the Belize employees it appeared Quinn may be trying to hide the fact that his seminars just aren’t really in demand anymore. Rather than face up to this and change the format of the way he does things, he appears to be using an arguably deceptive method to make them look more popular than they are.

3. Having disinterested people at the back of the class took away from the experience the others in the class who weregenuinely interested in the material and wanted to get as much from it as they could and had spenta lot of their families money to be there.

Oil Company Mismanagement
I know both Sheila McCaffrey and Susan Morrice. I can remember many years ago when Sheila was telling me how she made so many phone calls to Susan to convince her to go on Tony’s seminar, so I find the court case all the more interesting. I’m not a shareholder but my interest in the case was mostly to learn more about Mr.Quinn to help decide my opinion on him, and for this purpose I’ve found the court case useful. I don’t know all the in’s and outs, but you don’t need to bea genius to spot serious mismanagement, and irresponsible, selfish directorship of a company when it’s this blatant.

Security.

We already saw that thiscompany Quinn was a director of spent USD $718,000 on his seminars in 3 years.We also learned that largely due to Quinn’s security concerns, the company spent $1,800,000 on security an surveillance, an amount the judge called“clearly excessive.” The excuses used to try and justify it were embarrassing. The judge said “the expenditure was made in very large part for the purposes of Mr.Quinn, who appears to have hired what amounted to a private army at the sole expense of INE.”

Information.

It’s really strange that in a company he controls, hundreds of people who made a high risk investment in an exploration company have yet to get a proper return aside from a small loan from the company. He appeared to be trying to block investors organising and sharing information. When I heard this it rang serious alarm bells for me. I was disturbed when I learned that Patricia F. was sent to the doors of a “rogue”investors meeting advising potential attendees not to attend or they’d be reported back to the company (and clearly get on the wrong side of Tony) What was he so afraid of them learning? It’s strange that ordinary shareholders are cautious to say anything that could be seen as critical of the company lest they get on the wrong side of Tony. He seems to be scared of people finding out the truth, and given his behaviour, he’s scared for good reason.

Loan Release Program.

I don’t know all the details but the judge called it a “bizarre arrangement” to punish and deny payment to any shareholders who didn’t support him. Mr. Quinn, who had the idea for the loan release program and never made any capital investment in the company took out $1,600,000 from the company through this arrangement.

Reputation.

They seemed to be making such a big deal about the oil company reputation and the company value. I always thought the value of an oil company was based 95% on the proven reserves. I think it’s Quinn’s reputation they were more interested in protecting. The court case also shows that there is no evidence that the large investment that was apparently close to coming from the Middle East, even existed. I’m not a shareholder but was offered to be in the very early days, well before oil was struck. I remember at the time thinking to myself that if this is a bunch of Tony Quinn people getting involved in a business it’s going to be a right mess and be handled badly.

Quinn Honesty.

I understand in the court case he said “I don’t remember” a lot of times on key issues.If he can’t remember so many key issues when asked to tell the truth, he’s either a liar or not 1/10 as smart as he claims to be. Either way, it doesn’t look good for a mind guru. He clearly needs to “learn to use more of [his]mind”.

Forgery.

In paragraph 27 of his judgement, Judge Bannister referred to a key document produced by the Quinn/Morrice board: “I’ve no doubt that this letter, which sits uncomfortably with the other part of Ms Morrice’s case, that Mr. Quinn was universally treated as a Class A member of INE from the outset, is a clumsy forgery”……“an after the event concoction written in an unsuccessful attempt to legitimize the allotment”.

Rejection of Quinn’s evidence.

In paragraph 38, the judge clearly doesn’t believe Tony’s version of events on a matter and wrote “I reject Mr. Quinn’s evidence on this point”

$201,000 Seminar.

Paragraph 71: “the latter of the two figures [$201,000] represented the fees to permit Ms Morrice, Mr Steward and an associate of Ms Morrice’s called Mary Ann Malone to attend a13 day seminar in the Bahamas. The invoice was signed off by Ms. Morrice. The figures are inherently preposterous and no reason has been given why the business of INE required, or justified, expenditure of this sort”

Maybe the conversation between Tony went something like this; “Hey, Susan! why don’t you and some friends come on my €50,000/$60,000 “mind masters” seminar and let the shareholders pick up the bill? You get a seminar in the sun, I get lots of money for talking for 13 days, and we’re all happy”

Class B Shareholders.

In paragraph 49, the judge writes refers refers to depriving Class B shareholders of rights; “It appears to be nothing more than another example of a retreat to Belmopan in order to deprive the Class B membership of rights.”

In Paragraph 91 the judge wrote: “the company’s true Operating Agreement has been flouted since August 2006 and has been completely disregarded since December 2007” This is after Quinn got involved. He continued “The present board shows no appetite for doing anything other than continuing to ignore the rights of the Class B membership under the 2002 Operating Agreement and its track record offers no grounds for believing that its behaviour will change.”

Referring to the period after Quinn joined he also wrote: “Company funds have been distributed in unlawful disregard to the principles of peri passu [pro rata] distribution”

“Mr Quinn, who has played a part in the affairs of the company since August 2007 (the LRP, for example, was his idea), turns out never to have been properly appointed to the board.”

He continues “a section of the membership has felt free in the past to treat company funds much as if they were personal property.

In paragraph 32, Sheila McCaffrey described a meeting where Quinn advocated “a number of sharp business practices which he suggested should be put in place in BNE”. Apparently Quinn“suggested that the parties set up their own offshore bank, which they would indirectly own and for which they would raise funds to be lent on to BNE at inflated rates of interested, thus creaming off profit for themselves at the expense of B shareholders”. Apparently “Quinn recommended the setting up of so-called profit centres, which would operate similar scams, presumably in the provision of plant, personnel and equipment. Although Paul Marriott supported Sheila McCaffrey on this issue, the judge rejected the evidence on the basis that BNS’s financial statements were professionally audited and were required to stand scrutiny by Standard Bank, the Government of Belize and the other large shareholder CHx. The judge said “Mr Quinn cannot have supposed that there could be any possibility of such arrangements going undetected” and that in any case “none of the supposed suggestions was put into place.” None of us,including the judge has a recording of that meeting and cannot be certain of what Quinn said.

However the reasons given by the judge aren’t necessarily strong enough to be certain.

– Just because they didn’t happen, doesn’t mean these bizarre ideas weren’t proposed.

– Lots of companies caught in scams had previously had their accounts professionally audited. E.g. Bernie Madoff

– Since Quinn made an enemy of McCaffrey over this issue and knew she could expose him over it, he clearly wouldn’t have been able to get away with it.

– Quinn does makes extensive use of offshore companies in his health shop and seminar business dealings.

– The judge already noted that the loan release program, which Quinn admitted was his idea, was a “bizarre arrangement to punish and deny payment”to some shareholders. It’s not inconceivable that this unusual arrangement which put shareholders needs after his, was also his idea.

– The people who claim Quinn made these proposals (Marriott, McCaffrey) don’t appear to have shown dishonesty in other parts of the case.The people denying the suggestions (Quinn, Morrice) however, have been shown to be less than honest and “continuing to ignore the rights of the Class B membership.”

Time and time again we see a lack of care and recklessness with other peoples money, or “OPM” as Tony call’s it. The way he is mishandling this company and practically raping it for money starts to confirm many of the suspicions I’ve been having. If fact, the more I discover about what has been happening, I find his behaviour quite disgusting.

Newspaper Sexual Allegations.

I’ve no way of knowing the truth so I can’t pay too much attention to them, or lend them too much weight. I work on the principle of innocent until proven guilty so it’ll be interesting to see what comes out in court. I can’tsay I dismiss the allegations in the way I used to.

Healing.

He likes to tell stories of how he used to be a healer. Conveniently, I think this apparently happened when he was in London so it’s not possible to speak with any of the people who have been healed. I’m aware of several people close to him who got sick in the last number of years (one so seriously he died). I could be under informed,but I’m not aware of a single one of them who was healed in any wayby him (apart from them all being encouraged to “get in front of Tony” and do more seminars). Considering he appears to have a track record of exaggeration and misrepresentation, I don’t believe his claims on his healing ability. They just don’t stack up with my own observations. He now has some convenient excuse as to why he doesn’t do healing any more.

Many Elements of Cultist Behaviour

I’m very reluctant to use the word “cult”, but below are some relevant and applicable extracts I copied and pasted directly from: www.howcultswork.com

Anbody familiar with Quinn’s set up might find these extracts interesting.

================================================================

What is a cult?
The modern definition of a mind control cult isany group which employs mind control and deceptive recruiting techniques. In other words cults trick people into joining and coerce them into staying.

Misconception about cults: Cults are full of the weak, weird and emotionally unstable.
Not true. Many cult members are very intelligent, attractive and skilled. The reality is that all sorts of peopleare involved in cults. One of the few common denominators is that they were often recruited at a low point in their life

Types of Cults

Commercial:
Cults that use commercial gain as their base are called “cults of greed”. They will promise you that if you join them and follow their special programme for success then you will become very rich. Often they will hold up their leader as an example and explain that if you do what he or she says then you will be successful too. Commercial cults use mind control to get you working for them for free, and to make you pay for an endless stream of motivational tapes, videos, books and seminars all of which are supposedly designed to help you succeed, but in reality are designed to enhance the cult’s mind control environment and keep you believing in their almost impossible dream of success. Of course they never mention that the primary way the leaders make money are by selling these motivation materials to-their group! For more information see below under the section, “Pressure Selling”.

Self Help & Counselling:
By doing their courses and seminars they claim you and your staff will become more successful. Once you have completed one course you are told you need to do the more advanced course, which naturally costs more than the last. These cults will sometimes request that you do volunteer work and that you help recruit your friends, family and work mates.These groups specialize in creating powerful emotional experiences which are then used to validate your involvement in the cult. The religious overtones are couched in terms which don’t sound religious. Many people have been bankrupted by involvement with these cults.

Exclusivism:
However cult leaders will tell you can only be “saved” (or can only be successful) in their organization alone. No other organization has the truth, all others miss the mark.So it is not the belief system that decides your future, but it the belief system AND your membership with that particular group.

KeyPoint:  Any Group which says you must belong to their organization to be saved is almost certainly a cult.

The cult leaders need to make you believe that there is no where else you can go and still be saved, and if you ever leave the “one true church” then you are going to hell. This is a fear based control mechanism designed to keep you in the cult. It also gives the cult leaders tremendous power over you. If you really believe that leaving the group equals leaving God (or means you are leaving your only chance to succeed in life), then you will obey the cult leaders even when you disagree with them instead of risking being kicked out of the group. Exclusivism is used as a threat, it controls your behaviour through fear.

Be very suspicious of any group that claims to be better than all the others. A religious group may say that other groups following the same religion are OK, but they are the ones who have a better grasp of the truth and they are superior to the rest. This is often just a subtle version of exclusivism.

This is one of the practices that cults are often very deceptive about. For example, first off they may give you the impression that they think you are a true Christian, Buddhist or Muslim and it’s not until later that their true position is revealed.

Fear & Intimidation:

Questioning the leaders or program will still be seen as a sign of rebellion and stupidity.

Guilt,Character Assassination and Breaking Sessions. Guilt will be used to control you. Maybe the reason you’re not making money is because you’re not “with the programme”.

It could never be that the programme isn’t working, or those new recruits have valid reasons for not joining. It’s always your fault, you are always wrong,and so you must try harder!

Information Control:
In a mind control cult any information from outside the cult is considered evil, especially if it is opposing the cult.Members are told not to read it or believe it. Only information supplied by the cult is true.

Pressure Selling:
One of the most common forms of commercial cults is the pressure selling organization. These groups ostensibly make money by selling goods via their sales organization, but in reality they make their money by selling goods and motivational materials to their sales organization. Using mind control they seek to enlarge and maintain their sales force, and hence their profits.

Some names along with the bad reputations of these groups are well known to the general public, so their recruiters need to be very deceptive. They will call and ask to come and meet you to discuss a “business opportunity” or new “eCommerce venture”, not once mentioning the organization behind it. In fact if asked they might mention a completely different name. Meeting with them will involve a long intense presentation carefully designed to convince you that you could make a lot of money by following their plan. Only near the end will they briefly mention the real organization behind it.
Here are some key warning signs that may indicate a cult is trying to recruit you.

Hyped Meetings
Rather than explain to you what the group believes or what their programme is up front, they will instead insist that you can only understand it if you come to a group meeting. There everyone around you will seem so enthusiastic that you will start to think there is something wrong with you. They create an environment where you will feel uncomfortable and the only way to become comfortable is to join them. This is an application of controlled peer pressure.

Intense Unrelenting Pressure
They call repeatedly. Meet you on campus or outside your work. Trick you into coming for only an hour and then lead you into a long study, meeting or talk. They have to keep the pressure on, otherwise you might snap out of the mind control environment they are trying to immerse you in.

They tell you that they are not a cult.
This is a pre-emptive strike against the warnings from friends and family members which they know will come. Basically if any group tells you that they are not a cult, or that some people call them a cult, then for goodness sake find out why!
Key Warning Signs:
• Single charismatic leader.
• People always seeming constantly happy and enthusiastic.
• If you are told who you can or cannot talk to or associate with.
• Say they are the only true group, or the best so why go anywhere else.
• Hyped meetings, get you to meetings rather than share with you.
• Experiential rather than logical.
• Asking for money for the next level.
• Saying that they have to make people pay for it because otherwise they will not appreciate it. This is of course a very silly reason, plenty of people are able to appreciate things which they did not pay for.
==================================================================
…….cultist behaviour.

Cult is a very loaded word and there are grey areas about what is and isn’t a cult. You could easily argue that many major world religions are a cult. In the very strictest sense I’m not sure I would call Quinn’s organisation a cult, but I do think there are very strong cultist elements. I’m not sure how important it is to you whether or not“Dr.” Quinn’s organisation is technically a cult or not. I think it helps to look at what you are doing in the future. Would you still recommend or trust him? Would you still attend the Sunday seminars and listen to him relaying his same stories of business success, healing etc..?
Is Tony Responsible?

When discussing these issues with some Educo friends it has been said to me that although there are some arguably crazy and dishonourable people surrounding Tony, that there behaviour is not his responsibility or fault. I think there’s a lot of truth in the old saying that “you’re only as good as the company you keep.” Personally, I don’t like spending time around associating with dishonest and untrustworthy people. This doesn’t seem to be a problem for Tony. Looking at “Dr.” Quinn’s life and actions, I see a consistency of lies, taking unfair advantage of people and mis-representing his abilities and results.
Coming to terms with it.
When the yoga people discovered that John Friend was taking their money and defrauding them, it was very difficult for many of them to come to grips with it. He was their greatest life teacher and they had grown so much through his teachings/seminars. Some of them seemed to find it hard to process at first. It can be hard to grasp and wonder how someone so good, could have such a side to them. I have had this feeling as well. It’s normal. There’s a feeling of surprise and almost anger and feeling stupid for being duped.
How were we so duped and why could we not see the reality, even though Quinn told us he was helping us see reality?
I’m no psychologist and I have no expertise in this area, but here are the reasons I suspect. There are probably others in addition:
– For many people (not all), the seminar was a high point in their lives. They were in a beautiful hotel, in a beautiful place in the sun and leaning life changing lessons. Many people had deeply moving and peak experiences in this environment. Quinn is a skilled teacher and obviously we inextricably associated him with what we saw as high quality almost spiritual teachings. To us, he was on the same level as the teachings we valued so highly, so in our eyes he could do no wrong. A criticism of him, amounted to a criticism of a part of our lives that meant so much to us, so we naturally paid little attention to it.
– If I noticed anything about Quinn that I wouldn’t normally approve of, my mind spontaneously made excuses for him for the reason above.
– Because of how we felt, anyone that criticised him was seen as being negative and anti-life.
– Quinn talked regularly about the fact the people have been out to attack (not physically) him all his adult life but that he didn’t pay attention to the newspaper reports or what was said about him. He just got on with doing what he was always doing. The message we would have taken away from this is that we should not pay attention to these reports either.
– Much of the press reporting about Quinn in the tabloid newspapers comes across as highly unbalanced and lacking in substance. This can make a supporter, more adamant in their defending of him. I remember a report on him in Monte Carlo titled “Boom & Bust”. The gist of the article could have been condensed into “look at him off enjoying himself in expensive Monte Carlo with his big boobed, young girlfriend while us Irish struggle at home with the recession”. There was very little substance to the article. I remember a Sunday Tribune piece in the early 2000’s which was highly critical. A friend of mine knew the journalist and offered to give an honest story of how the Quinn seminar had helped him. I know people who tried to phone the Joe Duffy show to say positive things but the producers weren’t interested. The media had no interest in hearing a positive side and just wanted to only attack. Since I had positive experiences with Quinn, this sort of reporting only served to make me more adamant in defending him against criticism as I perceived some of the attacks being baseless and unbalanced. The manner of the reporting only served to make me more pro-Tony Quinn
Where are you right now with all of this?
I started writing down the list of items at the start of this article as I just wanted to decide to myself whether or not I would endorse him anymore if somebody asked me about him. This is not a case where I read one “negative” article on him and then jumped ship. I’ve given this a lot of consideration as objectively as possible. How does it sit with you? Do you totally trust Mr. Tony Quinn in the same way that you used to? The good news is that Quinn doesn’t have to matter to me at you. It actually feels mentally liberating to step outside of his influence. Similar teachings (pitched at different angles) are available from lots and lots of sources even though he is highly skilled at putting his teaching across.
To any people who still think Mr. Quinn is completely genuine and honest, I suggest you take a step back and give careful consideration to everything you’ve seen with your own eyes. There may be a feeling of feeling duped and “how could I be so stupid”,but when you face up to reality it feels really refreshing and renewing.
Don’t be afraid to discuss these issues with some of your Educo friends. You might find several of them are thinking the same things to themselves but are cautious to say it aloud.
In terms of perspective for this article, I’m of the (personal) opinion that although Tony Quinn has caused harm, he has only caused a fraction of harm in Ireland as has been caused by the Catholic Church.
If someone asks me now why I no longer support Mr. Quinn, I’d just sum up my thoughts by saying I noticed too much incongruence between what he said and the poor behaviour he exhibited, particularly in relation to the oil company and I do not trust him anymore.
I hope my thoughts can help your or others to have an honest appraisal of your own direct observations of Mr. Quinn. In the comments below I’d welcome both comments that do and do not agree with this article.
Educo Fan.

84 Responses

  1. I spent a lot of time reading the TQ articles and comments over the christmas holidays. I did not register the comments here. I am alarmed at the recent comments from 2017. This is very triggering as I know one current recruiter was dismissive of sexual abuse victims. I also know another I spoke with on May 4 this year could not care for children who are sexually abused; they literally lied to me on the phone that they knew about Educo when we now know they have been associates of Babu Shah since the early 00’s. I am commenting here in the hope there might be a commenter who will be alerted and can respond. Thank you for sharing

    Like

  2. Hello from Kate,

    I will be back in Dublin next Wed.I will speak with you then.

    Best Regards.

    Liked by 1 person

  3. Thanks Cath for your testimony. I replied to your email so do get in touch and give me a call at 0872396229 as I would like copies of the pics and to talk further to you about Tony Quinn.

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  4. Hello,

    As one of the older member of T.Q yoga classes. I started in Baggot St with a handful of other new members. I was very interested in Health and well been, and so started my ten year Journey with the T.Q Organization.

    I worked with Winnie and her then Partner Tom McKenna, who joined the T.Q yoga too.

    We visited Tony at his home in Arbour Hill over the years. He used a shed at these meeting to read our Auras. There was a lovely man called John Butler who was very talented as an Aura reader.

    In the beginning, it was all great fun, that’s how it started out. We moved into a Commune in Artane, Then Columbas College in Templeogue. From there we moved to Howth.

    I have Photos of Ned D and myself outside the Dandelion Market, canvassing for the T.Q with a huge poster Board.

    I have all the programmes on attaining Self Realization and the White Brotherhood. Very innocent at the time.

    When we moved to Howth, the situation began to change. Tony Quinn was already in London and America.The Group had bought him a Car.

    As a matter of interest, Tony had the sexual interest in Boys as well as young Girls. He was not able to have a Relationship with his women peers. If the Woman was anyway Educated he was not able to hold his own.

    He even had a Relationship with a young Girl from the Templeoghue Commune, who was about four when she moved in with her Parents. By the time she was 17yrs he was dating her, even though she would have seen him as her mentor.

    As I watched all this incongruence develop with T.Q over the years, I started to question everything about the Organization I was in. I was always told I was been Negative or I was not doing enough to be Realised.

    What I really believe is, I was growing up and developing my own mind and that after Ten years it was outgrowing his attractiveness to me.

    I wish all I knew at that time well, I hope Life was good to you all. We all choose the Journey we are on. Sometimes we meet good people who can teach us, and they also learn from us.

    If anyone would like a Copy of my Photos, from the 1970/80, when we used to go to the Body Building and lots of Photos of T.Q I will pass them on {FREE}

    Best Regards,

    Cath Sullivan.

    Liked by 1 person

  5. Hi!

    I saw that stuff and it instantly filled me with energy and hope, just take a look here

    My Best, lotusdemon

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  6. Educo Fan “It almost reminds me a little of one of those Indian spiritual gurus who’s very rich and has a lavish lifestyle supported by a group of poor devout followers. Somebody else said to me that Quinn is like an irresponsible bar man continuing to serve a drunk who isn’t aware that they’ve already had too much. Considering the hypnosis we’ve been through, I don’t think it’s a million miles from the truth. People have pointed out to me that the organisation doesn’t aggressively pursue seminar attendees who haven’t paid.”

    Quinn is living with a woman Eve and has several female servants. Very typical of guru living. He is irresponsible for using hypnosis for days and hours on end. psychotic episodes are ignored. I never heard of anyone getting on a seminar without paying. I have heard the educoists aggressively pursue past seminar attendees to go on more seminars.

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  7. “Once your in and you try to leave they wont let you until you’ve been fucked.” Too many lives damaged because of Quinn’s illusion of entitlement to everything they own. Watch out for recruiting splinter groups, the liars who say they have nothing to do with him any more. Turmoil of mind body and spirit inevitable when still caught up in the mind-set, still under illusion they are superior to ordinary people. The road to psychopathy is paved with mirages of grandeur. Seminars start abroad in April 2016.

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  8. Even saying he is still a “good teacher” makes me want to throw up. Wake up the man and his entire operation is a fraud and it stretches farther than just that. Don’t get be started on Belize and the bull they have pulled on hard working people. Once your in and you try to leave they wont let you until you’ve been fucked.

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  9. I’m reading Educo Fan’s account again and find the following very interesting particularly when he and others, when filling out the questionaire, exagerated their success. Quinn’s claims are totally untrue as he hypnotically influenced them before they filled out the questionaire. I totally understand why he and others felt compelled to do this as ‘truth’ does not come into it ‘lying’ is seen as ‘positive’.

    His Business Success (or lack thereof):
    We were led to believe that several business have been highly successful because they are using the Educo business system. Quinn has brought people up on stage showcasing their business as an example of his/Educo success. If that’s all the information I went on, I’d be going away thinking that these businesses were highly successful largely due to Quinn’s system. However I found months later that some of these businesses had later gone bust. I didn’t hear Quinn update us at the next Sunday meeting that these highly “successful” business had gone bust, along with teaching us what part of his system needs to be adjusted to help ensure other businesses following his success system didn’t fail. It also brings up the question of why businesses he a significant shareholder in, and apparently should be highly successful, would fail at all. In the recent court case involving the oil company, Judge Bannister who was not under any hypnosis to Quinn, could only summarise the amazing business system as “no more than advice to promote better employees in preference to inferior ones.”

    Scientifically proven business success:
    The results of this Scientifically Proven Business Success came from questionnaires we were asked to fill out on one of the Sunday seminars in the early 2000’s when the country was in an extended boom. We would have been listening to him talk for hours about being successful etc and then with everybody in a high and hyped mood we filled these out. I forget the figures I used but I remember in the moment I filled out the results in the most positive, possible terms, using gains I hadn’t yet realised. I’ve spoken to other people who admitted to me that they exaggerated the results they put down. It’s an understandable thing to do in this hyped environment where you’ll feel like a loser if you’re not oozing success. If accountants and auditors evaluated the bank accounts and investment returns of each person who filled out these questionnaires, I’d be surprised if they differed much from the national average. From my own observations of the people involved and the circumstances in which the results were written down, I don’t in any way believe this business success is “scientifically proven”, although I don’t see Tony looking for any scientific independent testing to revalidate the results people wrote down that day (or the results Quinn claimed they wrote down).

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  10. Many of us would not have continued going if we had known the truth about what was going on and I feel so lucky that I was not pulled into the ‘enlightenment’ con; the alleged sexual initiation and gagging that I was told was witnessed by other men in the group. Attending a few seminars in the 90’s was sufficient for Tony Quinn to make a move on someone if he thought he would get away with it. I was also told, although sometimes I feel that this particular person was warning me, that if you were attending for 10 years they are interested in bringing you into the core group and it was not all sweetness and light like they would have you believe. Quinn used physical force to shock them into doing something. It is much easier to influence and manipulate a long-time attender although I would say many were brought in before the 10 years. It is during the initial stages they tend to let down their guard and Quinn and Co. move in for the kill to bring another victim into their cult who will work for next to nothing if not nothing at all. Too many of us were fooled by the initial subtle changes occurring that appear positive but beneath it all the mind is gradually taken over to the point where very little else really matters. A red flag went up when I noticed problems increasing with family members and pressure from the above mentioned to attend a seminar. The niceties are put to the side and all hell would break loose if I and others were to confront them about it. Aideen Cowman, Martin Forde ,Margaret Forde and (Brendan Madden who was totally caught up in using hypnosis to prove it worked); not one of them asked for permission and used the guise of relaxation to put me under hypnosis . This, I feel, is a violation of human rights. It does have an effect on thought patterns and behaviour, however, their ‘subtle’ and, at times, the nasty approach of ‘top brass’ put me on my guard. It is quite a shock to the system and took years to get over and work through. If any of them are writing and tutoring about the ‘positive’ effects they need to own up to the damage of ‘negative’ affects and stop blaming the victim for ‘negative thinking’.

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  11. I attended one of his seminars which he hosted in Howth about 20 years ago – we only got to meet him twice for hypnosis type sessions which to be honest scared me. The organizers built him up to be this wonderful person we should all be in awe of but I found it hard to take to him at all. I did return home with an element of brainwashing but thankfully my gut instinct kicked in, in time and I saw him for what he is before I got sucked into spending thousands on future seminars. I worked with a very driven man who thought nothing of forking out €30k (€15k for his wife and himself) to attend a seminar in the Bahamas – me and many other colleagues didnt even earn this kind of money in a year. I am not sure if he is still a Tony Quinn fan but his ex-wife certainly is & runs an Educo gym. I am not saying TQ is all bad, there are elements of what he does and says which are good but its the feeling of being in a type of cult where he plays God that concerns me and indeed many others.

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  12. Unfortunately we have gotten to a stage where we need to check out if there is any cult influence in colleges. Numerous people trained in The Tony Quinn Centre for counselling/psychotherapy, yoga, diet etc., they go on to study in other colleges and retain the cultish influences. It makes it difficult to choose a cult-free college. I attended a college that I believed had no cult influence only to find otherwise.

    Relying on a gut feeling is an option. When a tutor recommends a book, and the author/authors are known to be members of a cult, the alarm bells should go off. It is a sad fact that students are targeted by cults.

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  13. I haven’t read all of the above but when I returned to live in Ireland as an adult in the late 1990s and looked for a simple yoga class such as I had done in England I discovered everything suchlike here in Ireland was TQ run and immediately recognised the danger of submitting to any such pervasive organisation in a field where auto suggestion can be exerted. I simply gave up the idea of doing yoga anywhere in Ireland and with anyone other than by myself in the safety of my own home. Seems I was right.

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  14. It sounds like they are still under the ‘spell’ of ‘Merlequin’ the scourge of INE.

    I’ve read Shiela is back in INE as a director. I wonder how she is coping?

    I’ve just found out, from a horse’s mouth, that Tony Quinn loved to watch old vampire movies starring Vincent Price. The women swooned in his arms and so easy to seduce and devour. Swop blood for energy and you get the picture. His great ‘philosophy’ includes so much we don’t know about, or at least, he thinks we don’t know about.

    Alas, it would not be the ‘This Is Your Life’ story Quinn would want. He held/holds his ‘pups’ in awe of his ‘superman’ escapades and his power over women. The truth is out!

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  15. What is the story on Niamh Hannan’s parents Brendan and Mary?
    Seeing that they got so many free oil shares for bringing in people who actually invested their own money in the oil project, they really have sat on the fence when all the corruption has been going on. I was at the members group meetings about the oil and Brendan only seemed to want to defend the company, Susan and Tony. Maybe that was why he could sell shares when no one else could. Mary seems to be a total devotee and Brendan seems to look after his own interests completely ignoring the situation of those he sold shares to at over $300 a share.
    I believe he was in a position to know what was going on in the company as he was heavily involved with Sheila from the start, why did he not support her when it is obvious that the others were the corrupt ones. Why did he not do more to protect those who bought into the venture because of him?

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  16. I’m disappointed that Maire was harrassed and vilified when she was the only one to have the courage to bring it out into the open. Seeking justice is never easy. However, I am totally in agreement that other women who underwent the same or similiar alleged sexual rituals need to come forward and support her.

    It is very disturbing news to hear that Margaret Forde is still practicing psychology/counselling courses. Apart from them being a waste of money, as they will find it very difficult if not impossible to get accreditation, the courses are influenced by Tony Quinn’s ‘philosophy’. This set-up comes under the ‘therapy’ courses that need monitoring. No doubt the material is presentable as she is very good at ‘making the right impression’. However, as you all know my experiences were not therapeutic in the accepted sense of the word and highly dangerous. I would advice everyone who underwent her ‘psychotherapy’ to take a careful look at how their life changed and whether they were influenced to become part of EDUCO by attending Eccles Street for ‘relaxation’ or ‘Success for Living’ programmes. I have checked the recommended Code of Ethics in the practice of Psychology. Margaret Forde broke practically every ethical standard recommended. I would urge anyone ‘treated’ by Forde’s to write to the Department of Health, Validation Unit, Hawkins House, Hawkins Street Dublin 2 and make a complaint. Her very biased ‘belief system’ and her coercive use of deep relaxation/hypnosis is not something she advertises or explains as her mode of practice to her clients. When I was looking for a counselor I found it very disturbing to see familiar names on the recommended list. None of them stated they did courses with the Tony Quinn centre. The controversy about Tony Quinn would pose a hindrance to their practice. Even when I was attending Eccles Street it was recommended to deny association with Quinn. The advice to disassociation from these courses and using acceptable credentials from other colleges tells its own story. The ‘top brass’ and their ‘qualified’ students are masking what they do as I cannot see how they can practice without breaking the Code of Ethics recommending by the Accreditation Board.

    It’s also disturbing to hear that McKenna and the ‘Cobra’ are still operating on behalf of Tony Quinn. Sounds like the ‘good cop bad cop’ scenario used by Scientology etc., I was talking to someone who admitted getting phone calls to borrow money for a second seminar by McKenna who was very scathing about the difficulty this person was having paying back the loan for the first seminar. He blamed him for his lack of ability to get a second loan. I also know of a woman who was distressed about an incident of sexual assault by McKenna. Tony Quinn showed an interest in her too. I am wondering if she has come forward yet. Their behaviour was predatory.

    Knowing about Quinn’s greed it is possible that Vinnie ‘has a roof over his head’ and nothing else. I’m surprised to hear that Hugh Chambers is a bully. It just goes to show how good they are at hiding the effects of Quinn’s influence. Sounds like they will never be free of Quinn. Sad really when I remember them as friendly although I did see the conditioning they were under. Wouldn’t be surprised if his ‘friend’ Derek has been left out in the ‘cold’ although Quinn would be taking his chances as he knows a lot. If I am to believe past posts not one of them has anything to show for their longlife ‘friendship’ and service to Quinn.

    Another name that springs to mind is Brendan Madden. He was in awe of Quinn and, like the others, emulated his manner and pattern of speech. Is he still involved with Tony Quinn? What is the other guy’s name who studied in Milltown? They both gave Eccle Street courses at the same time. What happened to the woman who lives in Tony Quinn’s cottage in Arbour Hill? Totally enamoured with Quinn. Is she still working for him? Disturbing to think of the effect he had on her. Stay true to yourself!

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  17. Hi Angie: Margaret Forde is still involved. She is involved in teaching on the pyschology/counselling course along with Niamh Hannon who runs a spot on parenting on newstalk and has a magazine column that she writes about parenting. Niamh is very good friends with Caroline McDonagh. Niamh’s parents have been very involved with TQ for many years and were instrumental in helping people buy the shares in the INE company in Belize. I am not sure how they all feel about TQ these days after everything that has happened. They were always polite people but very dedicated to the cause and although I never heard them speak against anyone they certainly wouldn’t speak to you if you weren’t involved in the in crowd and didn’t have a lot of money.

    Vinnie has been unwell for many years and he lives in Hicks Tower in Malahide. He wrote a book of poems that is available to buy in the healthfood stores.

    My understanding is Hugh Chambers is still very involved the last I heard of him he was living in Howth and working in the shops. He makes my skin crawl just even writing this down. I found he to be a vicious bully and I would cross the road than ever speak to him again.

    Derek is still around and still referred to as TQ’s best friend although I have no idea what he does.

    As for Tom McKenna I haven’t witnessed Tom trying to get any girls for Tony. I always found Tom to be polite and I rarely heard him say anything about anyone. He runs the meetings in Eccles St along with Collette on a Tuesday night and the Sunday meetings. Tom would always make an attempt to speak to people if they approached him. I am disappointed to hear that there are allegations against Tom for sexual assualt though not really surprised. I could not help but quite like Tom he was always lovely to me even if he did attempt to get me to go on other seminars. I was never told to borrow money by Tom. I always thought he was a bit more levelled headed than most of them.

    Collette on the other hand is rude and openly makes comments and will not speak to you if dare to ask a question or disagree with anything that TQ says. If you do not worship TQ Collette will ignore you and she has her group of long standing TQ devotee’s that all pretty much behave in the same manner. Collette is also unbelievably rude to Tom at times. I was shocked when I witnessed this behaviour I know I wouldn’t put up with it. I have heard others also comment about it. Who knows what that was all about. ?Another technique to confuse people???

    Don’t forget Jim Fitzgerald and his appalling behaviour on the seminars as well.

    I am still shocked at how taken in I was by all of this. Your comments about Derek his best friend and the aura business to make TQ look better. What a terrible thing to do to your so called best friend. A normal person would want their best friend to look good and would do what ever they could to do so. A great spiritual master may talk about ones “faults” but they would do it in a way that was supportive not to humiliate and debase and they certainly would not compare themselves to make themselves look better their just would not be any need to.

    I look at the people I met when they first went onto the seminars and watched how behaviours changed over the years and I honestly believe that anyone who became involved with TQ were very nice people in the beginning but they came under the influence of TQ and this changed their behaviour. Some of these people I have not had a good experience with and would say so but I still believe they were originally looking for the spiritual enlightenment that many of us are searching for. I was lucky to get away I wonder how difficult it is for some of these people especially as their financial future has been destroyed by only working in the shops and going out to seminar after seminar. Look at what has happened to Marie Lalor for having the courage to get out and take a stand she has had a dreadful time at the hands of these people and even if they wanted to get out would they have the courage and tenacity that Marie has for the onslought.

    Its great that women are finally coming forward with their tales of sexual assualt and hopefully Marie Lalor’s court case will bring in a
    guilty charge and will pave the way for further cases however I would say she needs backup from anyone who has also been assualted by TQ.

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  18. Disappointed Educoist; thanks for information on Aideen Cowman and Martin Forde. Margaret Forde is out of the picture now? Would not surprise me if she was still practicing EDUCO style therapy. Since Quinn squeezes the last drop out of his workers it would surprise me if she is allowed to retire. I would advice everyone to stay well clear of her and the other two!!! As long as they are connected to Quinn they are influenced by him. My experience told me, loud and clear, they don’t care about people they hurt. ‘Relationships’ are contrived to further Quinn’s aims. Once you are out they have no interest in you and, believe me, this is a good thing as it can lead to the road of recovery from their mind control techniques. If they had a conscience they would have walked away, like the women who lived in Howth did, as countless others do when they wake up to what has being going on over the years and at seminars. Anyone involved in the Quinn set-up, particularly his followers of old, have a responsibility to speak out about Tony Quinn and put an end to his abusive cult.

    I remember attending earlier seminars and so would know some people who were involved with Quinn.

    Where is Vinnie now? Is he still involved with Quinn? That man stood by Quinn through thick and thin. There was no Quinn without Vinnie. Where is Hugh Chambers? Another lifelong server. Have either of them been paid yet for their life service to the criminal Quinn? Why don’t they sue him? Or are they afraid of being incriminated themselves? They need to come forward and do something before they are ‘tarred with the same brush’.

    What happened to his old friend Derek? His hair looks like a toupe on top of his head. I saw him once on stage with Quinn in the RDS in the 90’s. As the story went, according to Quinn, Derek had once been a very handsome man who got the girls. The whole charade gave me the impression that, even with Derek’s success with the women, he wasn’t a patch on the ‘Mighty Quinn’. Sure wasn’t Quinn blessed with the ability to ‘make this world a better place’ and in a far better position to get all the girls he wants without his help? What could be better than that? Derek paled into insignificance standing beside the great man. His aura was darkened so we could see for ourselves who the better man was.Who would fancy him now? A very subtle and audacious put-down of his ‘best’ friend. The competitive streak in Quinn is boundless and many of his ‘right-hand’ men would have faced the same treatment and worse. His ‘pups’ are told, in no uncertain terms, who the boss is.

    Can anyone tell me why Tom McKenna and the ‘Cobra’ Collette M have they not been charged with avoiding taxes by putting money into offshore accounts in Jersey? Is Quinn manipulating workers in the Tax Office? I am also surprised and wonder why McKenna has not been charged with alleged sexual assault as his behaviour was noted by many over the years. Did he replace Derek with finding the girls, I wonder?

    DI have informed us that many women are, finally, speaking out about the abuse and it is to their credit they do so as naming abusers is the only way to stop this and those in the know have a responsibility to do it.

    In the face of alleged threats to DI and others, Maire Lalor is very courageous to continue coming forward and through her actions will draw more attention to Quinn’s Jersey company/s and those implicated with fraudulent behaviour. Justice is looming, a dark cloud of past actions need accounting for.

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  19. So what is this great breakthrough he talks about? What is so original about his work?

    For many years, during his research/seminars and up to the present day, he has talked about a person’s energy and asked his subjects to align their energy with his. What exactly does this mean? Does anyone understand what he is asking them to do? Is he accessing peoples source of energy and connecting it to his own with or without their consent? Do they fully understand the power he exercises over them? I perceive it as giving away personal power without knowledge or consent, giving away the very substance that keeps us alive. I suggest that it opens us up to persuasion and manipulation that gains strength when coupled with hypnosis.

    Many hold him up as some kind of ‘saviour’. Why is this? Is it because they have felt the effects of his manipulations on their energy and think him unique? Or has he accessed their ‘unconscious attention’ hypnotising them into believing how powerful he is?

    Does he build up a person’s self image regardless of how ridiculous they look and make them feel so great that they think there is no-one on this earth like him? His seduction holds no bounds.

    If it is possible to connect to another with our energy then where is this connection made? This is why I use the analogy of the unborn child connected to the umbilical cord or even a young child who is connected/dependent on mother to provide all needs. Regardless of how this child is treated, including chronic abuse, the child sees no other way of surviving but to stay with her or, at least, make a show of obedience. Disconnection from the umbilical cord may cause death. Any ‘fighting’ for separation on the child’s part is seen as rebellion and punished. Disassociation from the ‘source’ will cause pain, at least, this is what Tony Quinn and ‘top brass’ ‘bring about’ particularly if they fear you will ‘spill the beans’ by talking about your experiences. This chronic abuse, without understanding and support, may go on for years.

    The analogy of the umbilical cord might sound far fetched to many. People who have been with him for years may understand why I would think it appropriate as an explanation of what happens.

    Any insight or information the ‘devotee’ attains, or gains access to, that contradicts his ‘philosophy’ is automatically ignored otherwise they are liable to get punished with feelings of discomfort and, in some cases, fear of ‘negativity’. Those who ‘rebel’ are severed from the ‘source’ of ‘love’ and ‘success’ and ‘acceptance’ of ‘who you really are’ may find it very difficult to take back control of their lives and may return toTony Quinn. It is only when they realise how abusive he is that they make a break for it.

    What I see as unhealthy is the attachment to Quinn brought about by hypnosis, some would prefer the word ‘persuasion’ and how he uses this connection to continue his manipulations by programming people to sell seminars and work for him. Some have totally turned their minds away from personal choices ie career, relationships and previous ambitions they felt were important before coming into contact with him. This is a violation of personal choice and makes a mockery of human rights!

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  20. Educo Fan, thanks for your reply to previous posts.The more I read your original post the more I appreciate the time you took to work it out for yourself and am very glad you shared it with all of us on Dialogue.

    I am not a business person. I have no idea of how to run a business. I understand, though, how Quinn works his ‘philosophy’ on growing a business ie focusing on it and using visualisation to see a positive outcome of events and making a lot of money. You are quite happy to put this information into practice and say you get results. I appreciate that. However, many people have done this for themselves. Ambition is a great motivator.

    Quinn talks about getting the person’s undivided attention to install a programme. He talks about being the only one who does what he does. He accesses a person’s ‘unconscious attention’. Bypassing the conscious to access the unconscious, as I understand it, is the practical side of his research and the reason why it was not accepted as being totally original as he claimed. It is similiar to the process hypnotists use. Rather than Quinn saying to his subjects, I am going to hypnotise you he presents it as needing your ‘unconscious attention’. Both refer to the same process which suspends reality and the ‘new’ reality is accepted.

    This is what I think happened to you and you now understand he added further suggestions along with your request! In my next post I have also used an analogy to explain how I see the direction of his research and the process of manipulation that enables him to gain and hold on to ‘devotees’.

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  21. Anonymous, thanks for your comment.

    I personally have no fundamental problem with honest people charging large sums for the training the offer. e.g. Brendon Burchard charges $45,000 for 12 (or so) days training with a small group in the Caribbean. However, he doesn’t promote himself as a spiritual guru, but just pitches it as business and effectiveness/performance training.

    I agree with you that lazy minds will blame someone else, but I think that in the context of your comment this is misdirected. I felt my mind was being lazy when I just believed everything Quinn said without question. Have you read all of the article above. If so, can you tell me that you still fully trust Quinn?

    David.

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  22. Disappointed Educoist…….I fully agree with these comments above:

    “Honestly if TQ was as wonderful as he likes to portray himself he would have a huge worldwide following, he would give interviews, write books, have accredited qualifications and be transparent. He wouldn’t have needed to embezzle the Group B shareholders from INE out of the money that is rightfully theirs”

    also

    “I hope that any Educoist who is reading these posts and sitting on the fence will start to realise just how clever this man is at duping us all and is laughing all the way to the bank. “

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  23. Angie….to answer more of your questions:

    “Was it worth 20,000 Euro? Do you still see it as a good investment? Can you understand why people would have the opinion that this information you applied to your business could have come from a book that costs very little and the idea of paying anyone a huge amount of money for it would seem ridiculous?”

    My answer to this isn’t so straight forward. I’d say “yes” and “no”.
    Yes, pretty much everything he teaches is lifted from many different sources from Buddha to Napoleon Hill. However, despite my dislike for so many things about his behaviour, I still think he has a talent for teaching this material in a way that is easy to understand. I still use some of this material every day……many years after my seminar……and this has been very valuable to me.

    I understand that my experience may be different to the experience of many others.

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  24. Hi Angie,

    To answer your question above:
    “Is it possible that the connection he makes with your ‘energy’ is strong enough to create some kind of symbiotic relationship that brings about an internal reaction to any criticism on Tony Quinn that links to your own sense of worth? Or is it that, without your knowledge, some kind of programme was installed to automatically cause a reaction to defend him?”

    I don’t know for certain if it is hypnosis or not as I’m not an expert on the issue, but think it’s as I explained in the article above. We associate Quinn with the high level of the material and this philosophy becomes a way of life. An attack on him or the philosophy feels like an attack on yourself, your way of life or an attack on life itself. He also taught us how these attacks from anti-life by pretty much ignoring them and not giving them any attention or energy.

    David.

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  25. To Ex-educoist: Bob Delmontque died on Thanksgiving day in 2011. He was 92. Apparently he was born in 1919 and had quite a colorful history as a young man posing nude in the 1930’s when it was illegal. That is probably why he is no longer spoken about. I think Bill is Bill Hueber the owner of Rush Fitness among other gyms in the USA. Bill & Bob knew each other so this explains how one met TQ and the other introduced them Who knew who first I don’t know but TQ was the one who benefited from this association.

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  26. I think the Bill referred to made his money on gym equipment or something related to that, hes tha man with the boat. Tony always talked about his friends Bill and Bob. I believe Bob (the old body builder) is no longer around, I also heard he wasn’t nearly as old as Tony said he was when he claimed to be in such good shape, he may also have had something in common with Lance Armstrong!

    Its no wonder Tony is referred to as Dr Spin.

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  27. To Angie: I am not sure whether this Bill is Bill Gates. I always got the impression this man was older than BG and made his fortune in property and I think if I remember correctly a connection to boats.

    In answer to your question regarding Martin & Aideen. Martin teaches the dietician course, he was the overall manager of the shops but I am not sure if he is still doing that, he does do consultations as he does have recognised qualifications in naturopathy.

    I think Aideen still does the odd relaxation course in Eccles St although personally I never saw much of her.

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  28. To Anonymous: Its interesting that you chose to compare Tony Quinn to people who are all well published authors who stand openly by their teachings and who all give credit to others for what contribution they may have given in understanding success, programming, alternative dimensions etc. Each of these people are transparent and have all been interviewed extensively by the media and stand by what they believe in. They also do not charge anywhere near the amount of money TQ does.
    I find incredulous that you consider someone to have a lazy mind because they dare to challenge the methods of TQ. Some would say it is a lazy mind that doesn’t question what is being “taught”. We live in a democracy and it is our right to question and report what has happened to us just as it is your right to disagree.

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  29. To Anonymous; Tony Quinn is a conman who takes control of people and what they own or manage on other people’s behalf. The others charge for their seminars etc and leave it at that.
    I have experienced some of the others you talk about and I agree that they all want to charge a good price for their teachings but it falls a long way short of €63,500 mind bending educo seminars where you are programmed to have another dose at the same price because the last one hasn’t worked.
    I suggest you park your beliefs for a while, immerse yourself in the facts of all the court cases mentioned here on this site and then decide whether Quinn really is what he portrays himself to be.
    I have been a seminar junkie and there are not many of these teachers I don’t know about, it is easy to get sucked into these groups as is also the case with scientology and other cults.

    Quinn is certainly one of the most dangerous around, for your own sake please take time to consider both sides of the argument.

    I have been in and now am out, was BLIND but now I SEE.

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  30. Anonymous; ‘all the well known names’ wouldn’t touch Tony Quinn with a ten foot barge pole. He plagiarizes the concepts of these people and passes them off as his own with a huge dollop of greed and self delusion thrown into the mix. We are not ‘blaming’ him. We hold him accountable for his actions.

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  31. It is a pity you do not explain why you think it is a good idea to pay Quinn for his seminars. We do not control who leaves comments here. If someone has a concern about a group we will follow it up. You can do it with Dave O’Connor one of TQ’s old operatives.

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  32. It is a pity you chose to only post anti- Tony Quinn messages here. Esther icks Antony Robbins Bob Proctor All the weLL known names charge more than TONY Quinn for so little. Tony Quinn actually delivers. But lazy minds will always blame some one else.

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  33. I am glad someone has the guts to say that the ridiculous cost of a seminar is outrageous. Finally we are all beginning to catch on to how much we were duped and conned by this cowboy. Will never go back and will forever tell it as it is.

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  34. Is Aideen Cowman or the Forde’s still working in Eccles Street? Where else do they practice? It is time to draw up a list of names of people who support Tony Quinn and post it on Dialogue. It will, at least, give them an opportunity to question what is being disclosed. Some of them already know and desperate to keep it hidden. Did they do it willingly or is it down to conditioning? At least readers of this blog will have some protection and stay away from them.

    The ‘curse’ of Cowman is null and void. What a strange statement I’m thinking but I know it is understood by many who attended Eccles Street. There is no need to be afraid of her. You have a voice. Use it!!!

    Please support the people who are coming forward now.

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  35. The name that springs to mind is Bill Gates.

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  36. To Angie: You are absolutely right in your post. Educo does have its own belief system. The negativity belief has been very difficult for me to shake and this has caused me not to stand up for myself when I should have done so and defended my “corner” so to speak on many occasions. This has had a far reaching effect upon my life especially in the past 2 years. I am beginning to think in terms of post traumatic distress especially since I have started posting.

    I have just read another post here on DI regarding the so called fortune that has been amassed. It is no secret that TQ wants to be a billionaire as he constantly talks about a man he knows called Bill who is a billionaire. It is very obvious that he is in direct competition with this man and it just illustrates the greed of this organisation. The more I post the more I cannot believe that I ever got involved in all of this.

    Honestly if TQ was as wonderful as he likes to portray himself he would have a huge worldwide following, he would give interviews, write books, have accredited qualifications and be transparent. He wouldn’t have needed to embezzle the Group B shareholders from INE out of the money that is rightfully theirs and he would not have needed to become a director of a company that he initially did not invest in, he would not have off shore companies, he would be fully Irish tax compliant and would care enough about those who were not as well off as him financially and maybe even do some charitable works to help displaced and disadvantaged people.

    Here is a man who is telling everyone how to use their minds to become wealthy and yet he did not even follow his own teachings when INE first started. Alarm bells should have been ringing in those who knew this at the time and his testimony in the court case what a joke. The judge calling his business techniques simplistic however this is a man who uses strong arm tactics and creates the idea that anyone who approaches TQ and does not have his best interests at heart will be flung across the other side of the room by his energy and they will be unable to approach him. I have heard this said on many occasions.

    I hope that any Educoist who is reading these posts and sitting on the fence will start to realise just how clever this man is at duping us all and is laughing all the way to the bank. To ask people to use other peoples money to finance the seminar, get people lie to get the money is at best immoral and at worst fraudulant. I personally have no problem paying money for something that is worth the cost but I cannot honestly say that this was worth the price I paid for it.

    Would the group B shareholders please do something to protect your interests before it is too late.

    I also find your posts keep jogging my memory to incidents that have happened over the years.

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  37. Disappointed Educoist:

    Good to hear from you again. I really appreciate your feedback and your posts have done a great job of jogging my memory.

    It’s interesting that you continue to feel disloyal to the Tony Quinn group as in ‘doing something wrong’ when you write on this blog. As I said earlier to Educo Fan, we got more than we bargained for when Quinn installed his programmes. The programme went so deep that some of his educoists still feel a sense of loyalty to him. Do they also feel guilt and disloyalty when disclosing the dangerous and woefully unprofessional techniques of Tony Quinn and his ‘top brass’?. I would say so but it should not stop them from doing it. I managed to work through that particular programme. I explain later how it affected me.

    In an earlier post, you wrote about how difficult it was to accept peoples perceptions that differed from your own and how you were not like this before being influenced by Tony Quinn’s EDUCO.

    I think a fear of ‘negativity’ is part of the programme. I see the similiarity between EDUCO and other psudo-religious and religious cults and certain types of groups who adhere to a belief system that influences how the group perceive themselves and others (the outsiders). They preach/suggest/install ‘truths’, belief systems that sway individuals to accept and to live by.

    EDUCO has it’s own belief system. One of them is to avoid ‘negativity’ at all costs. This programme can trigger an automatic self protection mode that stops you from listening to or accepting perceptions from others that do not agree with the group mindset. Tony Quinn took it one step further with his hypnotic programming and it manifests in how you feel when listening to others who are not ‘enlightened’. There is a genuine fear of being hurt by their ‘negativity’. The discomfort and effort put into protecting yourself, in many cases, causes a return to the group as they are the only people who ‘understand’ them. Relationships are formed that perpetuate their ‘reality’ and the group separates itself from others. They are the ‘chosen’ ones.

    I tend to base the evidence on programmes in how they manifest behaviourally and emotionally.

    Feelings of guilt and disloyalty are understandable when talking about abuse by anyone we had once considered important in our lives. However, what I experienced gives testimoney to something much more dangerous. The post traumatic distress caused by the programmes escalated when I spoke about what happened. There is a hightened level of fear to overcome when reporting abusive behaviour.

    I believe Tony Quinn and the ‘top brass’, set out to build ‘positive relationships’ particularly with people who have something to offer, that binds them to the group.

    They need to break through the feelings of guilt and disloyalty as the abuse far outweighs anything that he ‘brought about’ when he uses the opportunity to satisfy his own greed and gain another ‘devotee’ who finds it hard to speak out against him.

    I hope many more realise how meaningless his ‘relationship’ is and speak out about it. No-one likes to think they’ve been conned. Quinn has perfected the ‘good guy’ image for years. At some point in the seminar he manages, with his techniques, to woe them into believing this. To see it is to believe it.

    Stay true to yourself!

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  38. Hi Angie: another brilliant post You have described the programming to a tee. On my first seminar no body had personal time with TQ that I am aware of. If it did happen it was most likely to have been a few of the very wealthy men and 1 women who was also wealthy that were on the seminar. He didn’t really show much interest in the women otherwise.

    On my 2nd seminar he most certainly had personal time with the women who was considered the star of the show but mostly he might have been talking to people but everyone was around. I am aware that 1 of the women who was on the first seminar “spent a week a Tony’s house as she put it” after the seminar. She felt that it was a fantastic experience and wow did she go in for the hard sell when she was trying to get people onto the seminars. She completely immersed herself into it all and her profile was changed to suit Educo and she was certainly not the women I met on the seminar in fact quite the opposite. The men and women who were invited into the “in” group always had this attitude of superiority towards others. Incredible really especially when you consider how they treat other people.

    I didn’t have an experience of a loud bang during the relaxation sessions. I haven’t had much dealings with Ms Cowmen thankfully. I would agree with you that this noise was probably the protection that was meant for you. I just know that I kept having questions constantly pop up in my mind and even when I tried to convince myself that this was wonderful I always had this niggling feeling inside of me something wasn’t quite right. And yet at the same time I kept hoping that I was wrong and that “The Answer” was about to be revealed and that I was finally going to be able to “flip the switch” and I actually thought no effort meant no effort at all. I of course understand more these days. It was very frustrating to be following TQ’s instructions for nothing to be changing. I of course blamed myself and couldn’t understand what I was doing wrong and why I wasn’t getting all these so called amazing results that others were getting. When I tried to speak to anyone about this I was informed that I was trapped in thought.

    I absolutely agree with your comments about fears and phobia’s and the damage that can be inflicted and the difficulty of coming forward to speak out. Although I have been posting since May of this year I still feel like I am doing something wrong in writing on this blog even though I know logically this not to be true. I can only hope like yourself that more and more people will come forward to document what experiences they have had. This would help me to validate the experience that I had at the hands of Educo.

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  39. I post regularly and use words like programming and hypnosis and to me their practice is an infringment of human liberty particularly when done covertly as is the case with Tony Quinn. However, it just dawned on me that these same words were used by Quinn on earlier seminars so it should not surprise me that there may be no reaction to them from his previous ‘devotees’ including people who went on seminars. They were led to believe that he was doing something ‘wonderful’. Personally I cannot see anything ‘wonderful’ about being obsessed by Tony Quinn, only an abuse of human rights. They use different tactics to get you to work for them in the Tony Quinn Centre and, believe me, they are very cunning.

    Quinn is very economical with the truth about what he does but he cannot hide the obvious effects of his techniques and the words he uses to convey his ‘philosophy’. It is embedded to a degree that it is automatic; just flick the ‘switch’ and there is ‘no effort’. This term ‘no effort’ is seen as a big achievement on the part of the participant who then incorporates it into his life. At the same time, they are lulled into accepting that not committing the crime of ‘thinking about’ it is also something to be proud of and accepted by others as having reached a higher state of ‘being’. They are led to believe that this information comes from the knowing part of themselves; the higher self. I know that what comes from Quinn ‘devotees’ is what HE PUTS ON THEIR UNCONSCIOUS (programme) and nothing to do with their higher selves. The only time they are credited with being ‘wonderful’ ‘amazing’ and a ‘genius’ is when they follow the programme. Anything else is secondary; this includes previous personal choices in life. In other words, why would you waste your time doing something that is inferior to Tooooonnnnny’s ‘wonderful’ programme? He will create an amazing fantasy that keeps you enslaved to his needs and, while your cognitive faculties are out to lunch, will take everything you’ve got. With his belief that he deserve to ‘create a better world’ for himself there may be no stopping him.

    The outcome of installing fears and phobias, for whatever purpose, can ruin a person’s life and it can also stop them from coming forward to speak out about their experiences with Quinn as a fear of speaking out is part of the programme. I believe that this was deliberately done to those who showed signs of dissent or who were subject to questionable practices. Whoever you are, you need to come forward and receive available support.

    Did everyone have personal time with Quinn on the seminars?

    The process of undoing the damage, no matter how many years ago it happened, needs support and psychological help to regain health.

    Did anyone else hear really loud noise when they sat in relaxation classes with Aideen Cowman? I was informed that it was the measure of my ‘negativity’. It felt more like some form of protection against what was being said and I am eternally grateful that it happened!!!

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  40. Just to clarify my comment about anyone outside the inner group I actually meant to say those inside the inner group would have been exposed to extremes of this belief.

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  41. To Ex follower but I survived: Thank you for clarifying your post and what the intention was. I was sorry to hear that you have also had a struggle to rectify the damage inflicted upon you by Educo. I agree with your post that there are people who think they are actually smarter than everyone else because they have attended a seminar or 10. Anyone outside of the inner group will have been exposed to the extremes of this belief.

    I also agree with you regarding people who have never taken any steps to improve their lives and I am no longer working in the organisation I refer to and I have not kept in touch with many of them nor do I have a close contact with any of those I am in touch with exactly for the reasons you describe. There just isn’t any point.

    As much as I would like to agree with you regarding changing the perspective of those in Educo to see the world differently, to see a different reality until something really terrible happens to a lot of these people I doubt this will happen.I wish it would but maybe in time things will change.

    I completely agree with your comment regarding taking the perspective of others into consideration before making a decision. Before Quinn this would never had been a problem for me also in fact I probably took other people’s perspective too much into consideration before making any decisions. However after Quinn it has been a struggle even if I listened to the perspective and tried to take it on board it was very difficult and I always felt very uncomfortable doing so.

    Thank you for your offer of support I appreciate this. DI has suggested in the past about a group of us getting together and perhaps should arrange this through DI.

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  42. I have gone through your analysis of Tony Quinn and I think you have a clear understanding of the situation. I am already familiar with most of the material and would have come to the same conclusions particularly about his devious and fraudulent behaviour regarding INE and B shareholders.

    To get back to your personal thoughts about the seminar: you credit Tony Quinn’s ability to teach and how it has benefited you in your business. After the seminar you felt good about selling his seminar to others.

    I’m wondering if you are aware of how he combines his ability to convince and persuade alongside his ability to relax and hypnotise and how vulnerable a person is at that stage to take on his programmes? The crux of the matter is coming to terms with this. I believe that this is what happened to you. It benefited your business but the programming included more than you bargained for and I doubt you were aware of his inclination to add on additional self serving programming which would explain your reaction to criticism of Tony Quinn.

    Those who are influenced in this way believe that it was/is their own decision to ‘work’ for Tony. Are you still of the opinion it was his ‘teachings’ and how he put it across that brought about this change in your perception and willingness to accept what he talked about including selling seminars? Or can you acknowledge his, well documented, use of programming/hypnosis that brings about the ‘feel good’ factor and sense of satisfaction and total acceptance of Quinn in the final days of the seminar? The many you spoke to on your seminar are under the same type of influence you were so it does not surprise me that they would think the same and how great it was. Was Tony Brilliant and Amazing?

    Was it worth 20,000 Euro? Do you still see it as a good investment? Can you understand why people would have the opinion that this information you applied to your business could have come from a book that costs very little and the idea of paying anyone a huge amount of money for it would seem ridiculous?

    Any good hypnotist can focus you on applying good business practices. Hypnosis has the power to aid relaxation and lift depression and life looks a lot brighter. I have no doubt that people are very grateful when they benefit from sessions. However, I doubt they would leave the practice with the idea that they are going to advertise for their hypnotist and talk to all and sundry about the great benefits they had and talk them into parting with their money to go and have it done themselves. Unless, of course, the hypnotist has influenced them to do so and this would be considered highly unethical and, if it ever came to the light of day,would be reason to question whether he should be allowed to continue practicing.

    FINAL ANALYSIS: TONY QUINN IS NOT TO BE TRUSTED AND BANNED FROM PRACTICING IN EVERY COUNTRY IN THE WORLD!!!

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  43. Educo Fan:

    My previous post was about my earlier experiences with classes and seminars. The focus was on ‘being the best person you can be’ and visualisations about pulling the weeds out of your imaginary garden and seeing beautiful flowers etc., reminisent of the 60’s flower power era.

    I understood the later seminars were geared towards people to wanted to expand their businesses so had no interest in them as I don’t have my own business. Yet, when I was with the person who spoke to me about them I could see she did not want ‘no’ for an answer so I went along with what she was saying as I had already decided to put it on the backburner and make up my own mind either way. Suffice it to say my life was turned up-side-down due to programmes being installed in my mind under the guise of relaxation. I did not know that they did this to people before going on a seminar. I did not know that this psychotherapist could do this, period. It is highly unethical and, in my case, was setting me up for a very traumatic time with Quinn, who no doubt, would have suceeded in taking full advantage of my state of mind like he did to other female attenders. I was being set up to work for him.

    Many would agree with you that Quinn has a talent in convincing and persuading (some would say hypnotising) people. However, when I read your account of how you reacted to the incongruence of his behaviour and what he was saying it reminded me of how I used to feel and I too ignored his behaviour. I noticed that I would very quickly go back into a trance like state; this state was induced by Quinn himself when he noticed any form of questioning or discomfort in people due to what he was saying. This awareness of how incongruent his teaching were sitting with me were quickly forgotten about and not recalled till much later, probably months later and I would stop going to Eccles Street for a period of time.

    I remember him telling his ‘devotees’ that it didn’t matter what was said in classes; they could recite a poem and it would still have the same affect. In other words, what his talks consisted of didn’t matter, the result would be the same, whatever result he or they were looking for. He had already decided to bring about a receptive mind that took on his programming. The less aware of what he was doing or saying brought about the best results. Being lulled into having a receptive mind is his goal. He can do what he likes at that point. You were not going deep enough to block out what he would not have wanted you to perceive.

    It was interesting to read how your mind ‘spontaneously jumped to his defence’ and how any attack on him would cause you to feel that you needed to defend yourself. Is it possible that the connection he makes with your ‘energy’ is strong enough to create some kind of symbiotic relationship that brings about an internal reaction to any criticism on Tony Quinn that links to your own sense of worth? Or is it that, without your knowledge, some kind of programme was installed to automatically cause a reaction to defend him?

    What is really going on? It would depend on how you perceive and experience being with Tony Quinn that will influence your answer to this. You rightly point out that we perceive what is being said in a different way. By the way, he uses this analogy a lot and I have often wondered whether it was another ploy to separate those who take to his hypnosis from those who don’t. He does not take any responsibility for the ‘negative’ reactors, and by the way you would have been perceived as one if you had voiced your feelings on the seminar. I may not have the answers you are looking for as you seem to want to reject the concept of hypnosis as having anything to do with what happened to you. What do you think?

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  44. To Disappointed Educoist;
    I was certainly not meaning to be dismissive of the struggle others are going through, I didn’t get through it easily and needed a lot of help and support from others. I didn’t come through it unscathed either, especially financially but I’m working through it and, thank God, I have my head above water again. I had alienated myself from a lot of firends and family because of Quinn and these relationships will probably never be fully healed.

    I did have a choice though and I chose to take what good I could from what I did learn on the seminars but more importantly what I learned from the whole experience.
    I am a much stronger and smarter person now as a result of it all but I will not be giving Quinn and his cronies any credit for that. It’s funny that you can still come accross people who think they are smarter than everyone else because they did a seminar or 10, and then there are those who think they are smarter because they didn’t do a seminar, these are the ones that want to make little of you, stay away from them, they probably have never taken any steps to improve their lives, at least you have tried.
    I can assure anyone that gets out of this that they will be a lot smarter as a result of the lessons learned, Karma will take care of Quinn and the rest.

    The quote was directed at those who have not yet come to terms with what is really going on in TQ world, they need to change the way they look at things, then they WILL see a different picture.
    I have learned to look at things from other people’s perspective now before making decisions, something that had been taken from me by Quinn’s teachings and programming so I can assure you that the quote is relevant to us all if we are to make better decisions in the future.

    I wish you well in your recovery and if I can be any help to you please let me know.

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  45. To Ex follower but I survived: I am really pleased to hear that you managed to get away from this with what appears to be relatively unscathed. However I find your post quoting Wayne Dywer “When you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change” is very dismissive of the experiences that others have had from being involved in a cult and having been influenced by hypnosis that they did not consent to . I am sure that Wayne Dywer did not intend this quote to be used towards people who are trying to make sense and recover from these experiences. Wayne Dywer was a psychologist and I imagine was lucky enough not to have been under the undue influence of someone else.

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  46. To Educo Fan: I can understand the perspective from which you are coming from that until you changed your mind about TQ when you became enlightened to his true nature. Clearly when you came back from the seminar you had been influenced by TQ and gave him undue credit for your success. This is perfectly understandable lots people would agree with you on this point. although not everyone would.

    I for one certainly have never attributed any success I have had to TQ. I am fully aware that my hard work, education & ability to relocate were the reasons that why I was promoted and gained
    the success in my chosen area. This would have happened any way not because I attended a TQ seminar. Having said this I have still been influenced in a way that has actually been detrimental to my career because I now have a tendency not to stand up for myself because I am thinking of the impact this is having on my aura and aura’s of people around me. This is only one of the programes I have picked up from attending the seminars.

    However I digress from the point I was concerned that anyone who is reading this blog and not posting comments may not understand the reasons why people post on this site.

    I appreciate your comments about Joe Duffy I was verbally attacked at my place of work over TQ when the radio programe was on over my attendance at the seminars. This is bearing in mind that I had never discussed this with my work collegues but unfortunately for me a friend of mine had told someone I worked with at that time that I had been on a seminar. I was always treated with a level of distrust while I worked with this organisation and although I didn’t in anyway try to encourage people to attend I did have to defend my position and at that time I would not have heard a bad word said against Tony even though I was already very disappointed with the behavior of the “top brass” so to speak. It was very difficult being excluded and eventually I had to tell one of my collegues that it was basically none of their business as I didn’t push my beliefs onto them and I was entitled to come to work and not have to justify them. That was very difficult for me. The remarks ceased however the exclusion never did. I was seen as a complete idiot for having gone onto these seminars. Of course this meant that I was unable to talk to anyone how I might have been feeling about anything and I was working in a field where I had to spend more time with my work collegues than you normally would.

    I am very grateful to this site for the opportunity to be able to express myself regarding my experience with Educo. Until I read Angie’s post I would never have posted anything and it is because of this I have begun to unravel just what happened to me. I am now in the midst of trying to put my life back together and understand and make sense what has happened.

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  47. Educo Fan:

    The letter you sent is very interesting and, no doubt, a genuine account of how you previously perceived and now perceive the impressions and affects Quinn had on you. It deserves to be read and answered. I have done so to a degree. As it takes time to read through I will find the time to re-read it again and post my thoughts on it. Right now I feel like posting what I recall.

    To give a more balanced point of view and acknowledge the positive benefits I had, I have to say that I felt the relaxation classes were very helpful. Events in my life at this time were hard to come to terms with. In the classes I learned to relax more than I had done before and got positive feedback. It was very reassuring to be told, over and over again, that everything will work out perfectly when you come from yourself. It was very gratifying to feel that expressing energy, physically or verbally, was ‘making this world a better place’. It was also nice to be with other people. It was nice to see brightness and colours as anybody else I had spoken about it outside of the Quinn centre were under the impression that this could only happen if taking a mind altering substance. It was really nice to be free of worry and tension although I was not aware at the time that a trance state would bring this about. It was nice when people were friendly towards me and seemed to have time to talk.However, I will say that nearly all of them consisted of those working in Eccles Street and, in hindsight, it was in their interest that I was informed about Tony Quinn and his expectations when attending seminars etc and made obvious with stage demonstrations. Also, I thought there may have been interest on a personal level but ultimately the whole experience was geared towards involving me with the group.

    I valued the relaxation on seminars, when we sat together in the garden and deeper relaxation during the time spent with Tony Quinn while he was talking to us as a group. He did talk about the conscious and unconscious states of mind and how IT worked better if he bypassed the conscious mind. I did not know that trance states, confusioned states and hypnosis were being used to influence me in areas of my life that I would not have consented to. Although I questioned some of what he said in my mind I did not see the danger I was in. Most importantly, I did not feel comfortable with how, both women and men attending these seminars, were in awe of him and agreed with everything he said and asked advice as if he was some kind of oracle and this alone was enough to make up my mind not to be part of the core group. I did not realise that I was ‘in’ as I had become dependent on feeling good about myself and life and ‘didn’t I deserve the best anyway’? Why bother with people who did not understand the value of what Quinn had to offer? There is also the effect of trance/hypnosis accessing the emotional and cognitive states of a child and this is the level Quinn is influencing. This regression happens automatically when a person undergos deep states of hypnosis.

    We were given the impression that it was some kind of spiritual awareness; expanded awareness that brought about a better connection to how we experienced life. To most of us seeing energy and auras etc was very interesting. I did not know, at this time, that he ruled his workers with an iron fist or his interest in the female attenders, who were exploited by him, went beyond a certain point. I did not know that, being an audience member, I was being affected by what he was saying to another on stage whether I consented to this or not. In hindsight I can see that I, and many others, were being set up to serve Tony Quinn in whatever capacity he wanted, with permission and without it, or that he used mind programmes so strong that would create another identity that he or others could switch on or off. I later underwent programming without my consent and found it very frightening and had to learn to cope with acting out while feeling out of control emotionally. You need to understand that when someone gets badly hurt by members of Quinn’s EDUCO team or by himself it takes quite a while to come to terms with it. There is an explosion of anger when the penny drops! and has nothing to do with ‘getting back at him’ or anyone else involved. It is a very frightening place to be as bridges are sometimes well burnt at this stage with any previous support system. Add to this the deliberate continuous rejection of those who are hurt because they don’t ‘fit in’ anymore. They may question Quinn’s techniques or need to talk to someone about sexual abusive behaviour that took place that was very inappropriate or treatment given that caused worse problems and get called liars and stonewalled. Add to this the programmes, particularly if they consist of material that frightens the person into silence and they have a disaster on their hands when it all comes out into the public arena. I value your interest and comments.

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  48. The argument over whether positive things from TQ or an Educo seminar should be highlighted is only important so that those who have reached the point of questioning their decision to stay in up until now can feel at ease with the person giving the advice or sharing their views on it all.

    Sales people dont make sales by disagreeing with their potential client, they have to build rapport and you build rapport by highlighting and sharing similarities/beliefs, not differences. Once you develop rapport/trust then you have someone who may listen to your point of view. If they dont trust you, everything you say will be a lie to them.

    There is an old saying that should be considered here;
    “A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still.”

    My favourite quote in relation to all this is one by Wayne Dwyer;
    “When you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change”

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  49. I never got too much into the “energy”, never had these almost orgasmic fantastic energy experiences some people seem to have had. I’m a very hard working person with a lot of education and think I would have been successful in what I’m doing regardless. For many years I may have been giving TQ credit for my success, perhaps in a somewhat similar way that the owner of the betting company does. Now I see that any success I’ve had has been down to staying focused on what I want and working hard to make it happen.

    Bingo this is at the core you were giving TQ the glory when in fact you were doing it yourself.
    Cut to the chase and Quinn is out. John Boyle is still under the influence, hence he has Georgina loitering with intwent.
    The company is going down not up!
    when he becomes JB again he will start to treasure his staff and they will work their butts off for him.
    In the meantime what are the odds on DI at the High court next Tuesday?

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  50. I assume you know of Derek Lawlor’s role on Live Line. They are not that thick when people like that are sent on to defend Quinn. The main point is that Quinn has never been interviewed and refuses to debate his views. We invited him to our seminar in 2001 and what we got was abuse and I was personally thrown out of Eccles Street, by Vincent Hartford.
    http://dialogueireland.org/dicontent/resources/conferences/2001conference.html

    A good question to ask Derek L is has he been near Susan Morrice’s house in Denver? You do remember Susan Morrice claimed her bins were thrown over and her dogs frightened? The judge believed her story. Who would have done that. Hardly her former husband. Who would have had an interest in doing it. who would have wanted to freak her out? Keep her on board? Does anyone know where he is. He is the special ops person for Quinn. Any insights into his role in the org would be gratefully published.
    https://dialogueireland.wordpress.com/category/tony-quinn/
    https://dialogueireland.wordpress.com/2009/01/18/the-tony-quinn-story-%E2%80%9Cfrom-butcher-to-oil-slick%E2%80%9D/
    https://dialogueireland.wordpress.com/2010/02/16/summary-of-media-coverage/

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  51. This is a very important point Disappointed Educoist. I would like Educo Fan to clarify is he talking about the comments or about the posts. The comments up till you and Angie came along were basically attacks on Quinn on the one side and worship on the other. The posts which now take up material from over 40 years include the archive of material from newspapers, and I would be grateful if Educo Fan could show which ones written by DI are not written in a way to assist people. I can’t imagine he has read all the material as yet. Also he quotes some article from the Sunday World as if that is relevant. We are a library we do not edit the books we make them available.
    I am hoping to speak to him, and that is a better medium than comments. He is away, then I am . Talking to you gave a totally different perspective on your situation, and we need to be all talking together and asap.

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  52. …..the dzh444 post above was from me but cut typing on my smartphone wouldn’t let me finish it…

    10 people could listen to the same talk, from any teacher and come away with 10 different interpretations of what they heard and 10 different ways they’d integrate it into their lives.

    I never got too much into the “energy”, never had these almost orgasmic fantastic energy experiences some people seem to have had. I’m a very hard working person with a lot of education and think I would have been successful in what I’m doing regardless. For many years I may have been giving TQ credit for my success, perhaps in a somewhat similar way that the owner of the betting company does. Now I see that any success I’ve had has been down to staying focused on what I want and working hard to make it happen.

    Because I had what (I believe) were largely positive experiences, I glossed over the things with Quinn and the group that made me uncomfortable. Again I know several people who would see their seminar and post seminar experience being positive, and they too are only now starting to see through Quinn. I think it takes longer to see his many faults if your post seminar experience was positive.

    Regardless of any positives I mentioned, they in no way compensate for his behaviour, his lack of honesty and respect for other people and their property.

    Educo Fan, David.

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  53. @ Disappointed Educoist.
    I actually came to the same realisation as you:

    “initially I thought the posts were very negative but when I actually reflected upon that I began to understand that for some this is the only way they can express themselves at this time.”

    However, this only happened after I had changed my mind on Tony, or if I may say, became enlightened to see his real true nature, something which only happened recently.

    I get what you were referring about in terms of many people having no positives to report. I was referring to Joe Duffy and the Sunday Tribune who refused requests from some people I know to give their positive story. (By the way, some of those people I know who would have phoned in to Joe Duffy with a positive story would no longer think so highly of Quinn)

    Not everybody had the same experience during and after he seminar. Apart from being too pushy to get other people out on seminars, I had no other post seminar fall out, and as I mentioned I’m still using several of the teachings today.

    In short summary: be present, take responsibility for your own situation, let your mind think bigger ideas (I’m certain I have used this to grow sales in my company), keep focused on what you want and don’t give much attention to what you don’t want (aside from taking normal precautions to prevent what you don’t want happening),

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  54. To Educo Fan: In reply to your comments “most reports I have read which are critical of him never mention the positives” this is perhaps the people you refer to have been financially ripped off to the point that they are in so much debt that it is not possible to see how there were possibly any positives. I have learnt very little from Tony Quinn. I had already spent years searching for answers. If you have read the earlier posts I have discussed some profound experiences that I experienced on the first seminar however the fall out for me from both seminars were so awful that I would not wish this kind of experience upon anyone. This is the only forum available for Educoists to express what has happened to them and although I prefer to see posts that are written in a more articulate manner I can’t help but empathise with those who can only express themselves through the anger they feel as this is the only forum available to discuss and express what has happened before, during and after the seminars. Perhaps when anyone who has been onto one of these seminars and has had their financial future ruined, relationships destroyed & they themselves are now finding it difficult to cope with the realisation of what has happened is able to recover from all of this will be able to see what happened in a more positive light. Until this time it is be expected that many of the posts are going to be of a negative nature as this has been the experience of most of the people placing the posts. I will also like to add that initially I thought the posts were very negative but when I actually reflected upon that I began to understand that for some this is the only way they can express themselves at this time.

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  55. We used to take a stand at the RDS paying about €700 for it to help people affected by the cults like Scientology within at the Festival of Mind, Body and Spirit.
    when Anonymous came along in 2008 they totally changed the game plan. They did not go in they protested outside thereby they were not curtailed in the slightest. If you go inside you are governed by the rules made inside. Do not go to the event rather let us form anonymous Educo and those feeling intimidated can wear masks and those like me who could not care a stuff what they think let us get out there and start a protest movement. Once a month at the Eccles st HQ and at every public event a picket with quotations from the court case and assistance for those who want help. How many need to come to get going? Start with a few. Do not expect hundreds to show up. It will mushroom not in numbers but in the effect on the wavering.
    http://dialogueireland.org/dicontent/resources/video/tq%20protest.html

    Signed Press Pack

    http://anonireland.com/blog/

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  56. I was talking to another friend today about these issues. He had been speaking to someone else in Educo about TQ and this guy had come to all the same conclusions as discussed above, when talking to my friend (I don’t know if he had read the article above and failed to mention it to my friend). It turns out that many people who thought TQ could do no wrong are now starting to ask themselves if he is really who he claims to be and they appear to be coming to somewhat similar conclusions to above.

    I learned today that there are quite a few people, who would be fairly well known within the group, and perceived to be big fans of Tony, that no longer support him like they used to.

    I was at the last Sunday meeting TQ was present at. So was the friend I mentioned here. Neither of us would go to one again. I’d expect a lot less people at the one in the Helix on September 16th.

    If I could be bothered to go, which I’m not, I would be bringing up the court case issue with other attendees pointing out how I no longer think he is trustworthy. I suspect there’s a fair chance that most people who might go to this Sunday seminar may not taken any time to educate themselves about the facts of the case.

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  57. @ Dialogue Ireland,
    I would be very interested to read your views on why this article “shows cultist tendencies and attitudes.”

    You comment: “I believe it still has not gone deep enough into recognising the level of depravity involved.” I have nowhere near the level of exposure you have to damage Quinn has caused, so I would be clearly unaware of much of what you have come across.

    You comment: “there is a belief in the post that if you say some positive things about Quinn people will accept the fact they he was a con.”
    I think there may be a misunderstanding here, which I’ll attempt to clarify. You can see from the article above that I’m no fan of TQ and am now disgusted by his behaviour and actions. If I was now offered a free place on a 2 week 50k seminar I’d turn it down without hesitation. I’m finished with him. Despite some programs/hypnosis I took on that made me over enthusiastic about trying to push his seminars on everybody I know, I still learned quite a bit about how the mind works on my seminar (at the same time my mind was taking on his own programmings). Even a decade later, there are still things I used in my business this week that I learned during this time. I could have learned them from other people, but I happened to learn them from TQ while on his seminar and despite my dislike of him, I still think he has a skill/knack in making the teachings seem insightful.

    Despite the negatives, which I can talk about for hours, I did learn some valuable information (again, which I must stress, was not unique to him) As he is a skilled manipulator/hypnotist he is also skilled a getting across some teachings. When I deeper in the hypnosis, I fully credited him with this information, now I just see him as a skilled person in communicating the teachings of others (while subtly programming you to think he’s great and get people on his seminars). Despite the huge amount of negatives, most reports I’ve read which are critical of him never mention any small positives. When I was deeper in hypnosis, these reports had the opposite effect and put me into defence mode of TQ. They never seemed in any way balanced. I don’t mean “balanced” in that the positives must = the negatives, but that they don’t give any recognition that some people may just possibly have learned things that were value to them (along with the other programmings).
    I just wanted to acknowledge the positive, before I started discussing the many many negatives.
    I do think the comment “there is a belief in the post that if you say some positive things about Quinn people will accept the fact they he was a con”, was misunderstanding what I meant.

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  58. @ Angie, I fully agree with these comments:
    “the person who is affected is the last to find out”
    also
    “Quinn’s application of the programmes tend to go quite deep to the point where nothing else seems to exist in their lives so I can safely say that he has taken control of their minds. They, more than likely, would say that Tony Quinn does not control their life, that they had decided to do these things themselves anyway and how great his products, diets etc are, far superior to anything else that is out there etc etc. Quinn has succeeded in expanding the market for his products and converted another who will sell for him, whether he has agreed, verbally or in writing, to do it or not. If this person continues with the programme he/she is rewarded with acceptance.”

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  59. Within the group relationships are formed that are ‘positive’ and understood to be unlike any past relationships so reverting to making ‘normal’ relationships might take some time. The conditioning/programming may build up a fear of ‘negativity’, in other words, conversation that was once thought ordinary and acceptable became something to fear because of it ‘negative’ content. How do you react to people who are not ‘positive’ according to Quinn? How do you go about reconnecting with loved ones, family and friends? It’s time to commit the awful crime of THINKING about rebuilding your life.

    Going into a trance state is something we all do naturally. All of us daydream sporadically during the day. However, someone else inducing a trance state is very different as the content is controlled by this person. The recipiant may not know they are vulnerable to what is being said and I know of people, including myself, who have said or did something totally out of character after an episode with Quinn or his ‘top brass’. This may cause fear and anxiety of repeating itself inappropriately as of behaviour patterns or reaction to certain stimuli may be triggered inappropriately in the wrong place at the wrong time due to programmes set up for particular situations.

    I had not thought about a particular sentence I wrote in an earlier post to Educo Fan ‘the person who is affected is the last to find out’ but it’s so true. With some of us it is after the fact ie we are aware of the difference in our behaviour etc., with others it takes much longer. Other people, particularly family and friends, spot the difference in behaviour, language and thought form ie talking fanatically about things like weight training, diet and how great Tony Quinn is etc., that usually follows a seminar. It is very understandable that other people think it odd how fanatical they become.

    Of course, Quinn’s application of the programmes tend to go quite deep to the point where nothing else seems to exist in their lives so I can safely say that he has taken control of their minds. They, more than likely, would say that Tony Quinn does not control their life, that they had decided to do these things themselves anyway and how great his products, diets etc are, far superior to anything else that is out there etc etc. Quinn has succeeded in expanding the market for his products and converted another who will sell for him, whether he has agreed, verbally or in writing, to do it or not. If this person continues with the programme he/she is rewarded with acceptance. They are set up to reach their goal, or should I say his goals, of selling seminars or making more money from setting up gyms; a hefty sum to go on a seminar is manditory before working for him.

    What are the real consequences of their continuing association with Quinn? Falling into chronic debt is the obvious one. Nobody can convince me that Tony Quinn’s highly unethical manipulations to make more and more money out of the same people is not something he is aware of. He must know it is unsustainable and becoming a director of INE, although we now know it was illegal, guaranteed access to ex-educoists money. In fact, it would have been impossible for him to do it in the first place accept for his association with Morrice who attended his seminars regularly.

    If he was a bona fide researcher he would be interested in the outcome of his research and provide questionnaires to be filled out three months to six months after the seminars by everyone attending on whatever the seminar was geared towards. This has never happened. His only interest is in what effect his techniques have on them in the context of thought form (how much of the programme has taken) and how it will benefit him!

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  60. Angie could you contact me by phone in regard to
    1. Protesting outside Quinn’s outfit
    http://dialogueireland.org/dicontent/resources/video/tq%20protest.html
    How we can learn from Scientology. I won’t say much here due to confidentiality.
    2. How difficult it is for people to get over the conditioning. It is not therapy that is required but
    knowledge.
    3. Background on the current court processes culminating in the High Court next Tuesday. People are free to attend.
    4. Background on a number of women who have contacted me about sexual Assault.
    5. The latest Educo Fan post needs to be looked at section by section to see where it it still shows cultist tendencies
    and attitudes. You have rightly pointed out it shows a male perspective.
    6. I believe it still has not gone deep enough into recognising the level of depravity involved.
    7. Also there is a belief in the post that if you say some positive things about Quinn people will accept the fact they he was a con.
    Unfortunately, the person posting still has not fully understood thought reform.
    To use an analogy Adolph Hitler got the country going again after terrible problems, he build the autobahns.
    He is not as bad as Stalin or Mao. So what. Educo Fan is going in the right direction and we welcome his comments.
    Also the section on cults is good but the intellectual and emotional have not been resolved as yet.
    I am looking forward to dialogueing with him. When I started on this issue over 20 years ago we could not get any information,
    now we have great avenues to inform the public

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  61. Interested:

    Tony Quinn cannot hide from the law, nor can those who covered up for him. Many of us will know the people who aided and abetted his crimes. It will have a shocking affect on many and I have no doubt there will be casualities who will go through a horrendous time. At least we are prepared for it.

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  62. Ex follower but I survived:

    I feel the same way about informing as many people as I can to stop them going on seminars. This is what keeps me posting. He has to be stopped. I’m glad you got out of it. People are affected in different ways from his techniques and it sounds like you have worked through it. I am interested in meeting other people although I’d prefer if it happened when the time is right, whenever that will be; possibly when more information comes out to do with sexual allegations? etc., Standing outside Eccles St with placards or protesting at Tony Quinn’s day seminar is a good idea. I would prefer if there was a very large crowd attending this protest with lots of support for each other. You can meet up with anyone who has contacted Dialogue so leave your name if you want to meet up with ex-educoists. I’m sure you can understand the reluctance as many have suffered psychologically because of Quinn’s and ‘top brass’ actions. His staff and followers are totally dependent on Quinn and programmed to protect him.

    B shareholders, I’m sure, keep in touch to support each other in their claim. At least, I hope they are doing something about it.

    We’ll need to gauge how much support we can muster on the day/s.

    Stay strong!

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  63. as soon as the sexual alligations are all over the news papers when the case comes out they will be no escaping the truth. all his followers who are attached to him and defend him will also be in a sense be defending his behaviour in relation to the incidents. name of people who covered it up might come out puplicly.

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  64. Hi Educo Fan: It’s almost like, and I say this because you do not have to accept what I say about all of this; Quinn’s programmes can build a 2nd identity that will take them away from their ‘negative’ and ‘unsuccessful’ selves.

    However, the first thing that springs to mind is the ‘special’ feeling that some are prone to and I think we are all affected in some way with this to different degrees. There is a mini ‘death’ when letting it go. It is very important at this stage to go through it even though it is a painful process.

    ‘Dying’ to Quinn’s programmes may also bring a feeling of loss as it was encouraged to allow the connection with ‘energy’, along with his programmes, and I would advice disconnecting with him to regain personal control.

    This connection/alignment with Quinn maintains a sense of omnipotence and this may be what prevents some people from wanting to accept Quinn’s behaviour as damaging to others. Their sense of identity may be wrapped up in previous programmes, a sort of symbiotic relationship with Quinn. For instance, nobody likes to admit that thier mother or father is bad particularly during the years of dependency.

    Also some are attracted to the ‘spaced out’ and ‘high’ feeling that relieves them of stress. Regular attendance at classes maintains it so I would see it as important to stop going.

    Family and financial problems that need sorting are ignored or badly dealt with so the reality of having to deal with them may be overwhelming. There may be a terrible sense of loss here too as Tony Quinn was relied on to put things right in their lives.

    Behavioural changes may be triggered in certain environments as the training to ‘sell’ themselves is a programme. Also, they may be conditioned to prefer this identity even when they are conscious of the ‘switch’ and ‘act the part’ like an actor/actress would. Who wants to go back to their ‘negative’ ‘unsuccessful’ self? The people who have good self esteem may find it easier to stop acting on his programmes particularly if they stayed on the periphery of the group.

    Does Quinn direct his programmes to their unconscious or energy source or are they the same thing?

    Whatever he does it works. They will speak about him very positively and even talk about how he changed their lives for the better. The more they talk about it the better they feel as his conditioning resembles a ‘Pavlov’s dogs’ effect. To stop doing this they no long get their ‘fix’. I have also wondered if it stops people from developing naturally like a substance addiction would.

    The change back to ‘normality’ happens gradually, but as I stressed earlier, some will find it more difficult to ‘let go’ and I wonder if they have a real choice as continuous conditioning may block access to past memories particularly those who have been with him for so long. However, I don’t believe that all of them were affected in this way or unaware of what Quinn’s intentions were.

    Will send more posts as they occur to me.

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  65. Hi Angie,

    Your contributions here have been very good but I don’t think we should be afraid to meet, they are probably well aware of most of us anyhow.
    I know they would not be surprised to find out that I was involved, I have never hidden my feelings from any of them ever since I realised how false, deceitful and dangerous they all are, I have been on both seminars and had been sucked in, it was a challenging experience coming to terms with it all and getting out but I’m now stronger as a result of it all.

    They are very good at infiltrating meetings/groups etc as long as they have access to INE’s money. I heard that Susan and Josh were on the last mind masters in monte Carlo in July so we can assume that TQ is still in control. Emails and phones are probably still being hacked into.

    Maybe Dialogue Ireland would vet us all and then link us up??

    United we stand, Quinn always had a divide and conquer policy, if we don’t do something together how many more lives will he destroy?

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  66. Hi Interested; I think we need to be wary of all of them who played a prominent role particularly if they stayed with him from the beginning of two week seminars. It’s a sad state of affairs alright when we are not able to meet in person due to fear of being exposed and I don’t know what I would have done if I did not have this blog to ‘talk’ about it. Unfortunately, some of us know how nasty they are particularly the ‘top brass’ when they are out to protect themselves, they can be extremely nasty.

    Disappointed Educoist; agree totally about worldwide regulations. People like the above should be punished in some way for lying about qualifications etc., name put on a list for the public to see, banned from advertising and heavily fined and regularly checked would be a start.

    Little did we realise how much information we would get when we got up the courage to use Dialogue.

    Educo Fan; You are right. It was Spain, not Italy and I think it was another fruit that grew on trees that he ate so I’m taking it there are two stories. He’s an expert at confusing people so it’s not surprising they get mixed up. He’s really into the Garden of Eden mind trip. Now he has his Eve, God help her.

    I’m not sure whether he believes his own hype all of the time as it changes to suit what he is doing. Also he is more inclined to tell the group he is closest to ie under his control who are less likely to ‘spill the beans’ or call him out on what he is saying.

    I didn’t find out about the Jesus trip for a few years after attending his seminars even though I was aware of something being said though not clear enough for me to be sure. It felt more like they were introducing the idea first to see how I and others would take it.

    Aideen Cowman spoke about him as if he was God and used the word God but I don’t remember her saying that he IS God. Do you get my drift? They love to confuse. I would say that if I had said he was God she would not have disputed it.

    Did anyone else notice how bad their memories are when they’ve been with Quinn for a long time? I found it a bit odd when I brought up something in conversation that was talked about previously and I’d be met with an empty stare.

    I don’t feel comfortable at all when I realise how much of an effect it had on me although I have felt a change in myself for nearly a year now as my personality is more like what I remember it was before the seminars and classes. It’s one of those situations where the person who is affected is the last to find out.

    Anyway, life goes on. Keep the spirit up!

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  67. Hi Angie,
    I’ fully agree that “His deception was so subtle we did not see it.”
    That’s a key point. He’s very clever in that regard.

    To be honest, it really amazes me how somebody can read and agree with all the points in the above article and still be in neutral territory with regard to their opinion of Quinn.

    At this stage, I’m aware that I was somewhat brainwashed and I can thankfully see through TQ’s hypnosis. I wonder what hypnosis I might be carrying that I’m not aware of?

    e.g. I wonder if I’m still a little bit too selfish after being so into TQ’s material.

    Any other programs somebody is in danger of still running even when they emerge out of TQ’s direct influence?

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  68. Thanks Insider for naming him. Take a look everyone at his website, he is taking off the great man himself and all those unsuspecting people who do his training.
    Look at his “qualifications” none of the training institutes are listed!!! It just goes to show how important it is for this are to have some regulation worldwide.

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  69. To Educo Fan: Angie’s blog is all very poignant for me and describes so much what happens when trapped in this cult. Since I first started to write on this site I have fully begun to realise how badly I have been affected by this experience. I found it incredibly difficult to do so and I have since found that many areas of my life are falling apart after trying to keep it all together for so long. And having said that I am still finding it difficult to expose a couple of people very high up in the pecking order even though they have treated me very badly and hurt me very deeply. Such is the power hypnosis and programming.

    I have been reticent to go to a counsellor partly because of the programming and partly because I can’t afford it and also partly because I would be concerned they didn’t understand the nature of cults and I would end up feeling worse than I already do. I have this feeling that counsellors are not to be trusted. Most likely a programme that was constantly reinforced by TQ regarding thoughts, opinions, the press & TQ’s own brand of psychology.

    I found your comment that those who saw through the hypnosis more quickly were considered failure opposed to those who didnt’, it is an interesting point and one worth considering but I think it also boils down to those who were not willing to sell on seminars and asked questions or directly opposed at a meeting some of the information that was being discussed.

    There is a cohort of middle-aged women who go to every meeting every week in Eccles St and have done so for years and are still desperately trying to understand the information and asking questions they will never receive a straight answer to. It is quite sad to see when the latest mind master comes back full of themselves preaching to the masses and these women trying so hard to do exactly what TQ has told them but for nothing to be happening. I feel quite sorry for them because but the influence is so strong they can’t see its not them with the problem. I think the expectation is so high when the latest people come back because perhaps they finally have the answers everyone is searching for only to be disappointed again. There is such an air of expectation surrounding this that it is so easy to be caught up by it all.

    The court case surrounding the BNE share holders has certainly placed TQ in the spot light and since I have been involved with Educo there has not been this kind of attention on the organisation and its main man. Thankfully now there is direct evidence emerging so the public will be in a much better position to make an informed decision before going out to a seminar. I am hoping that the shareholders are considering their options about what to do next.

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  70. at one level at least he probably saw what TQ was and went out on his own. however bad behavior is still not acceptable. at lot of dangerous people surround TQ from what i see.

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  71. This is the guy.. http://www.daveoconnoronline.com/

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  72. Hi Interested. No the person in question is not called Gary. The person was very instrumental in getting a lot of people on seminars 10 years ago. At the time they were having a relationship with Caroline Mc and then moved onto to Tamar. If I understand correctly they are still living in the UK after the Educo gym they had been working in went belly up a couple of years ago.

    I wasn’t aware of the accusation of dishonesty surrounding money but after an experience I had with this person I am not surprised at the lengths they will go to to get what they want.

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  73. is his name gary? a crazy fanatical fan of TQ

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  74. Just had a thought. What happened to us ie taken in by Tony Quinn and his methods to sell EDUCO philosophy, gives us the perfect opportunity to use relaxation/meditation/reflection to help us comes to terms with it all. It is far healthier to do this than push away unpleasant feelings of being conned or, as some do, justify Quinn’s action, no doubt, by some programme he has laid on them. Quinn did talk about the eastern religious idea that to dis-ease in oneself is unhealthy. I passed this idea off as his own too like many others.

    Something that I found disturbing while attending a counsellor was the idea that I could stop what was happening to me, crying a lot etc., by seeing how ridiculous it was that someone could control me. This was extremely unhelpful and I quickly came to realise that not all counsellors understand the effects of cult mind control. If or when you seek counselling it is important to get someone who understands this area. The process of healing is much faster.

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  75. Forgot to mention; energy and how to use it has been known about for centuries in eastern religions. He uses it quite differently as in manipulating and hypnotising people into changing their thought processes. His yoga thought programme is very different to the original teachings. For instance, the idea of letting go of thought comes much later in the process of learning in the Buddhist religion as much of the teachings have high moral and ethical standards to adher to.

    The only person benefiting from these classes, in the long run, is Tony Quinn. The ’empty mind’ is much easier to influence.

    His ‘requests’ were being answered every week when the money came in and his dream (planned right from the start of his ‘mission’) has come true. Off shore accounts were his idea. That is when Collette was brought into the fold. He now lives the life he always wanted accept he didn’t bargain for the court cases and the people who are relentlessly persuing him for their money.

    How many people who gave their time and energy to ‘bringing it about’ benefit from it? Very few! The same people are sold and resold and pay out over and over again for the next, so called, breakthrough that is a rehashing of what he did years ago. The ‘chosen’ ones of the past are conditioned differently so could not accept his change of mind to fulfil his dream. They, being the well conditioned ‘good’ or is it ‘too good’ people they are, walked away quietly. At least one of them, so far, as been courageous enough to tell the truth about what went on and is bringing him to court for alleged rape and assault charges. Those who see through what Tony Quinn has done and is still doing are sickened by his behaviour.

    By the way, the phrase used so often ‘there is no difference between right and wrong’ was, originally, an eastern religious concept to help people come to terms with their ‘negative’ human tendencies; to sit with themselves as they are and accept responsibility for their behaviour so as to change it is the true meaning of it. Guilthy feelings are there for a purpose. There are aspects of ourselves we feel uncomfortable with and it is good to reflect on how our choices can cause damage to ourselves, other significant people in our lives and even the environment. Changing ourselves can be conducive to living a happier and healthier life.

    The way it was put across in the Tony Quinn Centre was very different. They took it literally and used it in a way that lowered any moral or ethical standards and this we observe as stories of what is really going on in that group are coming to the publics attention. From where I’m standing, they took it as, since there is no difference between right and wrong I can do what I like and have what I want regardless of how it affects others. Some become infantile in their demands for ‘requests’ and very upset if they think anyone is stopping them from doing what they want, just like a child would, which causes havoc in families. Some who don’t get their requests suffer terribly from depression and suicidal thoughts. Accessing childhood wants/demands is one of the most powerful ways of changing a person’s behaviour. Development of knowing the difference between right and wrong has not formed yet so the world becomes their oyster! and if this idea is not tempered with intelligence, like many of you who now question his ‘philosophy’ and criminal behaviour have still retained, it can get totally out of hand. There are no moral or ethical stands adhered to in the Tony Quinn Centre and other centres that ‘preach’ the word of EDUCO!

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  76. The ex-Educoists Dialogues – Putting on the Fog Lights! is the blog I am referring to above. Although it comes from the female perspective it is very much worth reading. You may not be aware of this type of coercion but it will help you understand the de-programming and re-programming aspect of Tony Quinn’s work.

    I noticed to that our language was becoming americanised as in WOW! GARBAGE! He was trained in America and took on aspects of their culture. Now he lives in Vagas spending other peoples money. This is the result of so many peoples hard work to ‘create a better world’.

    It is difficult to get books on the subject of cults in this country. I came across a book by Steven Hassan, titled ‘Combatting Cult Mind Control’. I was shocked at how many similarities The Moonies had to EDUCO training and how similar the programmes used to change people. Read it to believe it. Hassan has worked for many years to help people lose the ‘mindsets’ and get on with living their lives free from the influences of cults.

    Good luck with your search for the truth!!!

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  77. Educo Fan: I get the feeling that you are a genuinely nice guy who thought a lot of Tony Quinn. Many of us did, including your friend, otherwise we would not have gone to the earlier seminars etc.,

    Seriously, I think your friend is holding on to one of Quinn’s programmes. You are probably familiar with them. They usually consisted of phrases that were repeated over and over again and became part of his ‘talk’ that went on for hours on seminars. We were programmed how to think about Tony Quinn by himself and those giving classes. He never failed to have a story or two that would appeal and he was not adverse to making them up if he thought a particular slant would appeal to someone new in the group.

    The idea that what we did, relaxation, was put across as a form of Buddhism, a more advanced form of yoga. At least, this is what I understood from what I experienced and told in the class. I remember it being said that anybody can attend regardless of their religion and yet Tony Quinn put the catholic church down on many occasions on seminars. I recall certain things I said while in their company that I would not believe now and I don’t honestly know where they came from. I was being programmed!!! His deception was so subtle we did not see it.

    His true nature has finally emerged, very different from what he put across in the 70’s and 80’s. Those he worked with on the seminar believed he was Jesus. This was one of his original programmes and from what I understand there are people who still believe it.

    All Quinn had to do was put on a show of being the good guy. How to ‘create a better world’ was never spelt out to us, in fact, we were told not to read papers or watch television so what was it that needed changing? We needed to change ourselves and let him do it for us. He set out to influence and used programmes to change how we thought. We were shown how ‘great’ he is with demonstrations and led to believe that he had some amazing ability, the one who was going to make all the difference in our lives. He did have the ability to change peoples minds if they were susceptible to hypnosis. He picked and worked on those most willing to accept him. The rest of us sat back not realising that he was doing it to all of us. The great result was ‘drawing them out’ (their energy was at his disposal) and seduced, hypnotised into working for him. Growing his business and making money was his goal. Those selected were programmed into doing whatever he wanted and that included having sex to become ‘enlightened’. Most of us had no clue about what was really going on.

    I met a worker, another nice guy, who was used and discarded by Eccles Street and, seriously, all he could say to me was ‘Tony thinks I’m a nice person’.

    What you need to consider is the behaviour of his helpers. It is a reflection on Tony Quinn’s personality and training. I noticed, during the years I attended, that their personalities changed for the worse. They came across sooooo nice and considered themselves soooo special but if you showed any signs of disagreeing with some of them, especialy those high up in the organisation, another side of their personality came out and it was downright scary. Paranoia was rife and there were consequences for those who stood up to them. At the risk of repeating myself I would refer you to read another blog of posts from ex-educoists.

    Nobody likes to think they were duped or made a fool of. Consider it an education into another aspect of human nature. Quinn is the perfect speciman of a conman. They are usually gifted in ways that appeal to many people. He wants to fulfil his, so called, destiny and uses others to do the long hours of work needed to build his cult. The figurehead is revered and controls how he is seen in public, available and yet not available, human yet not human; better than anyone else in the world. AMAZING! BRILLIANT! PROGRAMMES ‘DR OF HYPNOTHERAPY’

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  78. I spoke to a friend of mine who had read this article. Although he agreed with all the points I made and couldn’t defend TQ on them he said “but I still think Tony hasn’t a bad bone in his body”.
    I think for the people who were seen to be successful within Educo (me included) the hypnosis is probably deeper as you can easily give credit to Tony for success when in fact was your own hard work and determination. People who were seen as a failure, may have seen through the hypnosis more quickly. Anyone agree?

    Educo Fan, David

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  79. Hi Angie,
    I fully agree with you that he is a skilled manipulator.
    I also think he can be a good teacher, albeit of other peoples material.
    Yes, I used to believe that story about sitting on the mountain top eating only oranges. I thought it was in Spain. I wouldn’t be surprised to learn if it was someone else who was up doing the meditation. Maybe he walked up a hill and got tired so sat down to take a rest and eat an orange. In his mind he was technically on a mountain eating an orange and might have even started believing some of his own hype before he repeats it ad nauseam to his followers.

    Hi “interested”,
    Yes, the penny finally dropped. Took a while!

    Hi “Disappointed Educoist”
    I’m glad you enjoyed the article.
    I wasn’t that close to the scene for many years and had never heard mention of the 7k to watch videos sleeping on makeshift beds. Did they think people would be that gullible and stupid? I guess they did.
    I fully agree with your comment with regard to anyone else reading these posts who may be starting to question TQ for the first time. You may feel like you’ve been duped and you are not alone.

    Hi “interested”,
    Thankfully, you wouldn’t come into contact with “the camerman” unless you do a seminar or get very close to Tony. The “role model guy” doesn’t have much involvement anymore, but years ago worked in the shops and had his image on the side of the protein powder tub.

    Educo Fan, David.

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  80. i hear a lot of comments about rude people but i hear no names mentioned or any details that need to be said so that the public know who to be weary of. i think i know who the camera man is but it´s not for me to say. the public have a right to know who to avoid when it comes to getting sucked in to giving money for a seminar. come on people speak out. details.

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  81. To Educo Fan: Thank you for your interesting comments. I was glad to see your post. I have been so disappointed by the behavior by TQ & those close to him for a number of years now. Until I had read the posts by Angie on this blog I hadn’t written down anything as I felt so stupid and duped by this organization. I was a person who was persuaded to attend the seminars at one of the lowest periods of my life as you have illustrated. I now have debts that I can not see how it will be ever possible for me to repay. I have never sold a seminar as I really hate the hard sell and if one thing this organization has done for me is teach me that I am not a sales person.

    You have actually reminded me of a number of things that I had forgotten for example the idea to get us to sell the supplements. Do you remember the idea that was thrown about around 5 years ago about paying around 7,000 euro’s to go out to the Bahama’s to watch dvd’s of Tony in his penthouse and we were to sleep on make shift beds in the corridors of his apartment. They were planning to send around 10-15 of us at one time. Of course Tony wasn’t going to be there. I at the time was appalled at this blatant way of trying to make more money for TQ. I don’t know who came up with this idea but it was just unbelievable. It was plugged for a few months and of course it didn’t happen.

    TQ’s criticism of anyone who was a spiritual leader for example the Dalai Lama was something else that did not sit well with me. A true leader would not feel it necessary to be so critical of anyone else who is actually at least attempting to practice what they preached. That was the one thing about Educo that troubled me the most I just couldn’t find people in the organization that practiced what they preached.

    The level of rudeness among long term devotees towards those of us who either did not want to sell seminars, did not want to buy into the gyms, did not want to work in the shops for next to nothing or attend the “courses” that are being sold at ridiculous prices, the same price as a years tuition at a recognized university for a qualification that was not properly accredited was frankly unbelievable. I was told that I was a loser because of my chosen profession and qualifications and that TQ would not be interested in me because money was the only way they could measure success and because I didn’t have any I was considered to be unsuccessful. The amazing thing is they actually expected me to look up to people who were some of the most awful people I have ever met and their idea of honesty would not sit comfortably with me.

    The use of hypnosis in the manner it was used by TQ was both unethical and down right dangerous. The seminars had information in them that I had read in books before and the relaxation made me feel very uncomfortable and I did not enjoy prancing around “living out my goals” for Jim to be sniggering and laughing at people which he did quite openly’ His behavior was to say the leas wast unbelievably unprofessional. Your treatment on the seminar by TQ came from the reports that Jim fed back to him during the seminars which again if this man was so spiritual this just would not have happened he would have ignored these reports or better still not encouraged them in the first place.

    Your information and links to the subject of cult’s are very enlightening and goes to show that this indeed has all the hallmarks of a cult. It is all part of the hypnosis that we were subjected to not view this as a cult and not to admit we are victims. I know how uncomfortable I felt writing anything that is negative about Educo like I was being disloyal no matter how badly I was treated and how much I had been lied to, lied about or how I received no benefit from attending the seminars. Believe me I tried to persuade myself it was all my fault that I was a “failure” in the eyes of Educo.

    I would feel very similar to Angie in her post above and to anyone else who are reading these posts and feeling like you have been duped or are questioning the techniques of TQ you are not alone and are not to blame for how you feel about Educo. It is a long and difficult process to unravel the impact especially a negative one.

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  82. I had a good giggle when I read your post. It’s the first time I’ve heard about his trip to an African mountain. I wonder how many oranges he had to bring with him? Or maybe he did a postal request that they would fall down from heaven.

    The story that was going around when I was there is that he went to Italy to meditate and ate a fruit diet. Later I found out that the woman who went with him did it while he sat around in peoples houses. Probably talking about the ‘energy’ and what an amazing guy he is.

    Many people were duped because of their ‘relaxation’ classes that includes hypnosis. You did well to avoid them.

    Dialogue will have information on court cases as they happen. At a guess it is probably in May next year.

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  83. the penny drops.
    i remember being encouraged to go on a seminar. when i first went along i had no clue of the whole TQ cult thing but the admiration people had for him was crazy and i felt weirded out straight away. i guess i´m just one of those guy who don´t respond to preer pressure. when i was told by caroline mc donagh that he acquired his information by meditation on an african mountain while on a diet of oranges, that was when alarms bell went off in my head. when i refused to go i was excluded from the group. i was told that the TQ center was a place of learning. silly me.

    it´ll be very interesting to see how the whole sexual allegations play out. i wonder when the case goes ahead

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  84. At the beginning of your article you say that you think of him as a highly skilled teacher; if this was the case there would be an open forum for discussing the material. I say he is a highly skilled manipulator; he does not welcome disagreement on any level and his seminars are used to hypnotise people into ensuring that the next seminar is successful. The only one who profits is himself.

    You admire Quinn’s ability to mix different teachings to present to people on his seminars. Gudni, guru of the MMS, does the same. It is purely to appeal to as many people as possible as far as I’m concerned. I have never heard Quinn quote anyone or point out anyone elses contribution. I also recall him being very scathing towards the catholic church but never heard him criticize Jesus or Buddha but then he thinks he is Jesus. I also think that it is deliberate on his part to put himself on the same level of spirituality as Buddha. This is important to him as it automatically appeals to those interested in being ‘the best they can be’ and a deliberate ruse on his part to come across as a ‘good’ person. Who would have thought he was setting up offshore bank accounts at the time or abusing the people who worked for him? Or stealing other peoples money?

    You are entitled to feel admiration for people who want to better their lives, I do too. However, I don’t agree with spending 20,000 Euro or larger amounts to go on seminars. Although I am sympathic to those who agreed when under pressure, I feel admiration for those who resisted the abuse and the hard sell; who refused to borrow money regardless of the psychological mind games that caused distress. They are seen as losers in the Tony Quinn Centre but to me they are on the road to finally getting their lives back. Anyone, regardless of who they are, are acting in a criminal manner when coerscing others by preying on them and weakening their level of self-esteem to make money for Quinn. This is what I experienced. In some cases their behaviour has had long-term detrimental consequences.

    Putting anyone into ‘unconscious attention’ (Quinn’s words relating to hypnotic trance and states of total unconsciousness) to induce a state of fear is abhorrent. I have no doubt that Quinn justified his behaviour to his earlier ‘devotees’ but I do suspect the ‘top brass’ and those close to him now have known about his intention to break people and re-condition for his purposes. Many still refuse to believe that their ‘spiritual high’ is hypnotically induced. This ‘high’ which can become highly addictive, I believe, is what people are experiencing on seminars. The ‘low’ is the punishment. It can also be brought about when they ‘strip’ you of energy. The person is made feel responsible for ‘negative’ feelings when it is clearly obvious to me that they are controlled by abuse.

    I too associated the ‘high’ with Tony Quinn. Now that I understand how he does it I no longer feel that I ‘owe’ him for anything. It was a great sense of relief to be finally free of the group’s influence. I continue to be open-minded about spiritual experiences. I will add, however, that it is imperative to take time out to heal from hurtful experiences caused by Tony Quinn and similiar groups.

    Thank you for adding information about the court case and what makes a cult. Anyone who has not considered what took place in INE is in denial. How people are enticed into a cult by appealing to their interests is very informative. I hope you get many responses to your post.

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